God I wish any version of this worked with OpenMW. This is by far my favorite melee combat mod--it's simple, straight-forward, doesn't jack with a lot of crap it doesn't need to jack with, and it still allows the whole 100% chance to hit, without being braindead easy. Does anyone know if there's a mod that does something similar to this that does work with OpenMW?
Do I really need to install MGE XE - which is a graphics mod - for this combat mod to work? I don't mind playing with Morrowind vanilla graphics and I do not care about graphics mods that much
So, does this mod make any changes to the Fortify Attack effect so to not render it completely useless? I'm just curious, I'm loving this mod as it makes leveling weapon skills not be a total pain in the backside.
I used to use this mod in the past and getting ready for a new openmw build for my wife and I to play. However I don't use the mwse or mge xe and few other mods bc they weren't compatible with open mw. Could you make an openmw compatible version that also doesn't require mge or mwse like you did in the past? Thanks for the great mod!
Thanks for the mod, so far I'm not using it, but I want to. On the description page you wrote that you took out the formulas for * Melee Critical Hit Damage * Marksman Critical Hit Damage * Weapon Degradation Rate and * Arrow Retrieval Chance. This means your own damage calculation (first listed on the description page as "Weapon Damage") should still be contained in v3.0. But I cannot find any damage calculation formulas in the main.lua. I wanted to change the damage and evading calculations to my liking, but if there are none of them in the main.lua file, I cannot edit them. Do you plan to add them, or did I miss something? I'm not a scripter, I just know some stuff from modding over the years. If I cannot configure the damage calculation, then any "always hit"-mods will be OP.
Also something, someone else already mentioned: If you always hit, then the leveling goes far to fast. Something must be tuned down somewhere, to balance this out, or at least give the players a hint, how they can do so on their own please.
Oh, the formulas are somewhat obfuscated, because the expressions I put in the script are embedded into Morrowind's own combat formulas (hence giving the formulas shown in the mod description). Unfortunately, there isn't much to be done to change these, and changing parameters may de-balance it. Feel free to send me a PM if you have something specific in mind, though.
Thank you for your answer. Yes, I have something in mind, although it's not fully finished. My wish is a more linear damage calculation, starting at very low damage output but increasing constantly, so high-end leveling still pays off, while the beginning of the game is fairly hard without companions, summons or magic/AI exploits. The core of my wish is this factor: WD*Skilllevel/100, so each skill level up adds 1% damage. WD = Weapon Damage
Melee Damage = (WD*Skilllevel/100)*(Weapon Condition/Max. Weapon Condition)+(WD*Strength/400) and probably some fatigue/max. fatigue modifier ... . Arrow/Bolt/Throwing Damage = same as Melee but with Dextery instead of Strength
I definitely would need to trial and test this and I haven't implemented the Damage reduction from Armor. For my own trials I would just use the vanilla method: Dividing the Damage by 'Armor Reduction'.
If my guess, derived from reading the description page again, is right, then your calculations for the evading chances are satisfying for me. (I guess the main difference to the vanilla formula is just the exchange of the attackers Weaponskill with the number 100.) I also like the addition of Nimble Armor. I want Heavily armored PCs+NPCs to be slow tanks, while light armored PCs+NPCs should evade more often.
I am playing with Nimble Armor and your mod together for 2 days now and I must say: I prefer it over my last playthroughs with my edited version of 4NM_Combat so far, but I still want to try out my more linear approach to the damage calc**. In my opinion it is too easy in Morrowind to deal a lot of damage early, through finding/summoning strong weapons and using chameleon spell. Hmm ... while I am writing this, I should probably try out a mod, that adds Skillrequirements for gear ... that way a too early high damage output could be prevented. ... Hm, I seem to have a morrowindish 'problem' in general.
**In the main.lua of 4NM_Combat it is possible to edit the damage formula, but I didn't want to analyse all the factors and stuff and do a lot of trials and errors, just to get this working, because even after succeeding this task the mod 4NM_Combat still changes too much for my taste.
An addition to the evading chances: Rather than just adding the defender's dextery and luck based factos, I would also substract the attacker's dextery and luck based factos from the evasion chance and additionally introduce a small speed based factor. It seems more logical to me, if the difference between the attacker's and the defender's stats are regarded, than just the defender's stats. A dexterous person has a higher chance to estimate the probable dodges of his opponent, because he will do it the same way and therefore has a sense for these movements and how to react to them or prevent them entirely through moving in a different / less predictible way or just more precise and fast enough so dodging becomes harder for the defender. This approach (substract the attackers dex/luck/speed-factos from the defenders dex/luck/speed-factors) has the desireable side effect of raising the importance of the Sanctuary magical effect.
There's a mod that cuts your leveling and Stat leveling in half because of all the land mods and being op to really enjoy those mods. I just got it along with the modders Stat decay mod to help level things out.
I have no idea how I managed to do this, but somehow the damage formula doesn't seem to work at all (I tested it several times at several skill levels and the damage was consistent across every attack), the accurate attack part of the mod works but I'm at a loss as to the damage part not working.
Unfortunately, despite what the mod advertised, in my personal experience it does not seem the mod is balanced.
First off, once you install the mod and create a save with it installed, it does not look like you can uninstall the mod. Even after deleting the mod from your MWSE Data folders, it will still persist regardless if you reboot. The only consistent way to uninstall the mod is to delete the mod, then reload a save prior to your installation. If you have the mod removed and then load into a save file that was used with the mod installed, the game will still act as if you have mod & give you 100% accuracy.
Now, moving onto how the mod performs in game. I am currently 47 marksman, using longbow and iron arrows. With the mod installed (for safe measure to make sure the mod is working, 0 Stamina), I can kill Betty Netch in 9 hits with fully drawn bow, as well as Cliff Racers are killed 4 hits, no miss.
With the mod uninstalled (I tested first with 0 stamina before, and sure enough I miss almost every single shot), it takes Betty Netch 8 hits to kill, fully drawn & 4 shots to kill Cliff Racers, only counting shots that did damage.
The issue at hand is that the difference in damage is really small, with Betty Netches taking only 1 shot extra with the mod. I know this is a really small sample size, but this should show that there may be a problem.
The thing that makes this even more unbalanced is not even the fact that the damage is so similar, but the fact that my shots are staggering the enemy. Without the mod installed, even at full stamina, I cannot kill Cliff Racers or Betty Netch before they reach me (the place I tested was right beside the entrance to the ancestor tomb behind Seyda Need, shooting across the water to the tiny islands) Due to the missed shots, the enemies would be able to get 1 or 2 hits on me before I could kill them.
With the mod installed, I could stagger them on every shot, they werent even allowed to move.
In the current state of the mod, as of August 30th 2021, I personally feel this mod is too imbalanced inorder to enjoy the game without making it extremely easy.
Testing out on a fresh character, discovered it makes leveling offensive skills insanely fast. Since you never miss, I was able to level Hand-Hand from lvl 15->50 in under 30minutes. The exp is quite huge
For anyone using NMM, you'll need to install the mod manually instead of using the 'Mod Manager Download' button because the mod's folder structure contains a uniquely named top folder with no 'Data Files' folder below it. So NMM will drop the whole mod into 'Data Files\Apoapse's Attack\...' instead of 'Data Files\MWSE\...' where it needs to be. This still occurs using the latest NMM v0.72.3. You can still use NMM to install the mod by just unzipping the manual download, renaming the top folder to 'Data Files', and rezipping.
159 comments
* Melee Critical Hit Damage
* Marksman Critical Hit Damage
* Weapon Degradation Rate and
* Arrow Retrieval Chance.
This means your own damage calculation (first listed on the description page as "Weapon Damage") should still be contained in v3.0. But I cannot find any damage calculation formulas in the main.lua.
I wanted to change the damage and evading calculations to my liking, but if there are none of them in the main.lua file, I cannot edit them. Do you plan to add them, or did I miss something? I'm not a scripter, I just know some stuff from modding over the years.
If I cannot configure the damage calculation, then any "always hit"-mods will be OP.
Also something, someone else already mentioned: If you always hit, then the leveling goes far to fast. Something must be tuned down somewhere, to balance this out, or at least give the players a hint, how they can do so on their own please.
The core of my wish is this factor: WD*Skilllevel/100, so each skill level up adds 1% damage.
WD = Weapon Damage
Melee Damage = (WD*Skilllevel/100)*(Weapon Condition/Max. Weapon Condition)+(WD*Strength/400)
and probably some fatigue/max. fatigue modifier ... .
Arrow/Bolt/Throwing Damage = same as Melee but with Dextery instead of Strength
I definitely would need to trial and test this and I haven't implemented the Damage reduction from Armor. For my own trials I would just use the vanilla method: Dividing the Damage by 'Armor Reduction'.
If my guess, derived from reading the description page again, is right, then your calculations for the evading chances are satisfying for me. (I guess the main difference to the vanilla formula is just the exchange of the attackers Weaponskill with the number 100.)
I also like the addition of Nimble Armor. I want Heavily armored PCs+NPCs to be slow tanks, while light armored PCs+NPCs should evade more often.
I am playing with Nimble Armor and your mod together for 2 days now and I must say: I prefer it over my last playthroughs with my edited version of 4NM_Combat so far, but I still want to try out my more linear approach to the damage calc**. In my opinion it is too easy in Morrowind to deal a lot of damage early, through finding/summoning strong weapons and using chameleon spell. Hmm ... while I am writing this, I should probably try out a mod, that adds Skillrequirements for gear ... that way a too early high damage output could be prevented. ... Hm, I seem to have a morrowindish 'problem' in general.
**In the main.lua of 4NM_Combat it is possible to edit the damage formula, but I didn't want to analyse all the factors and stuff and do a lot of trials and errors, just to get this working, because even after succeeding this task the mod 4NM_Combat still changes too much for my taste.
Rather than just adding the defender's dextery and luck based factos, I would also substract the attacker's dextery and luck based factos from the evasion chance and additionally introduce a small speed based factor. It seems more logical to me, if the difference between the attacker's and the defender's stats are regarded, than just the defender's stats. A dexterous person has a higher chance to estimate the probable dodges of his opponent, because he will do it the same way and therefore has a sense for these movements and how to react to them or prevent them entirely through moving in a different / less predictible way or just more precise and fast enough so dodging becomes harder for the defender.
This approach (substract the attackers dex/luck/speed-factos from the defenders dex/luck/speed-factors) has the desireable side effect of raising the importance of the Sanctuary magical effect.
First off, once you install the mod and create a save with it installed, it does not look like you can uninstall the mod. Even after deleting the mod from your MWSE Data folders, it will still persist regardless if you reboot. The only consistent way to uninstall the mod is to delete the mod, then reload a save prior to your installation. If you have the mod removed and then load into a save file that was used with the mod installed, the game will still act as if you have mod & give you 100% accuracy.
Now, moving onto how the mod performs in game. I am currently 47 marksman, using longbow and iron arrows. With the mod installed (for safe measure to make sure the mod is working, 0 Stamina), I can kill Betty Netch in 9 hits with fully drawn bow, as well as Cliff Racers are killed 4 hits, no miss.
With the mod uninstalled (I tested first with 0 stamina before, and sure enough I miss almost every single shot), it takes Betty Netch 8 hits to kill, fully drawn & 4 shots to kill Cliff Racers, only counting shots that did damage.
The issue at hand is that the difference in damage is really small, with Betty Netches taking only 1 shot extra with the mod. I know this is a really small sample size, but this should show that there may be a problem.
The thing that makes this even more unbalanced is not even the fact that the damage is so similar, but the fact that my shots are staggering the enemy. Without the mod installed, even at full stamina, I cannot kill Cliff Racers or Betty Netch before they reach me (the place I tested was right beside the entrance to the ancestor tomb behind Seyda Need, shooting across the water to the tiny islands) Due to the missed shots, the enemies would be able to get 1 or 2 hits on me before I could kill them.
With the mod installed, I could stagger them on every shot, they werent even allowed to move.
In the current state of the mod, as of August 30th 2021, I personally feel this mod is too imbalanced inorder to enjoy the game without making it extremely easy.