Hello! I love using this standing stone mod more than other ones honestly, but i did have to change some numbers in xEdit for it to fit my game more. I have a question regarding the Atronach stone. So by default Atronach stone reduces magicka regen by 75%, however i wanna make it completely negate magicka regen so that i can only restore it through potions which restore magicka. So is the value 75 in xEdit for Atronach stone the penalty for base magicka regen? And if it is, would changing it to 100 shut down magicka regen completely, even through food or magicka regen potion? And is there any way i can change Tower Stone effect from once per day to twice per day? Thank you.
Oh, damn. Sorry, I viewed the comment on my phone and forgot to reply later yes, that's the right way to "remove" any regen, including any possible buffs. If you set it to 100, there is still a way to get some regen through other beneficial effects/perks.
Hi. So I thought of 3 stones and how I think might be on par in "distinguishedness" with the lover stone: the Mage, the Warrior and the Serpent.
So for the guardian stones, I do think they should be the simplest of all, as they're kind of the "tutorial" stone. But I think we can give them a little something more so they are not just copies of themselves.
For the Mage, when you read a skill that increases the level of a skill, you get an additional level in the skill (+2 instead of +1)
For the Warrior, when you health goes below 50%, your damage increase by 25%
For the Thief, your bounties cost are reduces by 50%.
And the more complex for the last, the Serpent. Ok, so the Serpent made me think, it should (in my opinion) be the one who's bonus is statistically better than the others, but also get a counterpart that is also a major disadvantage. Because they are "the most blessed and the most cursed", while that give lots of room for buff and debuff options, I tried to stay close to the in-game Serpent Stone. In Skyrim, if you wish to join the Stormcloak, you are being sent killing a Ice Spectre (I think that's the name) to a specific place and Gunmar tells you "There's something there that attracts Ice Spectre", surprise surprise it's the stone. So that gave me an idea. What if the "curse" of the Serpent is that they attract danger on themselves ? The downside: Enemies detection radius are increased by 100%, and you receives 20% more damage from all sources. The upside: .Augment all your skills by 5.
Edit: Removed the warrior idea, it wasn't really good. Edit 2: Added a new warrior idea, changed the serpent upside (less complex while still interesting) and added the thieve stone.
Oooh, wait I have a better idea (for the lover's stone).
I don't know how hard it might be to implement, but I do think its potent and distinguished to not overlap with other stones.
As long as you have a follower with you, both of you (reminder that base game is only 1 follower max) receives a bonus to Magicka/Health/Stamina regeneration by 10%. If that same follower is your wife/husband, it becomes 15%.
So, right now, I'm not sure how it would work if someone were to use more than one follower. Maybe something like "As long as there is one follower, 5% (up to 10%), and if partner is in the group 15% but only for both of you."
Wow, that's actually cool and unique! Should be relatively simple with some sort of Cloak-like effect. The only thing I don't like is that it makes other Stones kinda bleak and simple
Hi, so I like the way you made the change, except for the Lover's Stone. I don't quite understand how being "graceful and passionate" makes you a better haggler. If I may suggest something else, when I think "passion" I think of someone invested in a project, meaning putting the work to achieve something. And while their isn't any "jobs" you can partake on, their are thing that let you create item that could be useful for others, the crafting skills. Alchemy, Enchanting and Smithing. What if, the Lover's stone power augmented by like 10% the potency of potion/poisons you create, the equipment you temper and the magnitude of enchantments ?
Hey I like the idea for Lover's Stone to improve crafting skills, but I think it will be outshined by other stones, since you're not doing crafting too often to justify spending your Standing Stone "slot" on this one. Initially I wanted to leave it with original buff (Skills improve 15% faster), but that would kinda overlap with Warrior/Mage/Thief stones that give the same buff but specialized on one particular set of skills. Technically, Lover's Stone improve your Speech skill and if I recall correctly, the reason was that gracefulness and passion in this context were interpreted as being sort of "charming"/convincing/eloquent, thus being able to naturally haggle in their favor.
That sounds too complex and oddly specific I tried to keep buffs as simple as possible, so that they were kind of "pick and forget" and they'll give you their effects. Whereas buffs like "Get X more of something for Y time after doing something" forces you to remember that you have to do things in a specific order and together in order to benefit from the bonus. In a way it's similar to the problem with active powers that are granted in the game, where you typically either forget to use them when needed or save them up for the time that never comes At least this is from my perspective
Also, now that I'm thinking about it, I think those Warrior/Mage/Thief stones already give buffs to crafting skills as those are grouped "by color".
Contextually, the most suitable bonus is indeed a buff to all skills, where whichever skill you pick you are passionate about it, thus being able to advance in that skill faster. But I don't think that Lover's Stone meant that kind of passion and all evidence support that doubt.
ah, I see. Sorry, missed it I heavily rely on emojis to get cues on the tone and mood of the other person's texts.
Anyways, Lover's Stone is one of those stones that are harder to find appropriate buff for while staying unique I'm open to any suggestions that would fit into the lore description and won't overlap with other stones' effects.
Thanks for taking time and bounce some ideas around!
I have been weirdly off-put by so many people's standing stone overhaul mods. I think it has to do with there being so many different stones, people end up struggling to bat a perfect game. Finding your mod, I am SO HAPPY somebody is actually quoting The Firmament here and thinking about making an overhaul that takes the shape of the lore. It may be the closest I've come to being happy with one of these mods.
That said, your The Steed stone explodes stamina-management based combat gameplay. The Firmament talks about hurrying, but you've effectively doubled the damage output of fighters during combat with this bonus, with no penalty. Unless the authors of the Firmament were imagining people born under the sign of The Steed being so hurried and impatient they cut down their foes twice as fast just to get on with the rest of their plans for the day, it seems like not the lore-intended bonus. It would be perfect though if you made stamina regenerate twice as fast only outside combat!
Hey thank you yeah, I felt that. This was initially a merge of effects from mundus and evenstar, but then I’ve learnt more in modding and felt like I could create something else that doesn’t deviate far from Vanilla and stones meaning (lore).
Good point about stamina that bonus was added mainly to lineup the “X regenerates twice as fast” bonuses for all attributes. And stamina nicely fits into a theme of the steed since you can’t be always rushing if your stamina can’t keep up.
It sounds good on paper at least definitely makes Steed desirable if you struggle with stamina management in combat.
But to be honest, I didn’t extensively play test this, so it might be a good idea to halve these bonuses in combat, though I’m not sure yet. I might create a sort of add-on that does it and upload in the optional section.
I would agree as well with this being most reasonable of standing stone mods with the least overpowered bonuses. Evenstar comes close, but this one fits better with lore i think.
However that steed sign is utterly imbalanced with as good as any combat mod. Either you have not tested the sign before or are not using such combat mods yourself, so just a short summary: Most of these mods use stamina as the one key resource for taking action in fight, dealing damage, reducing damage taken, allowing for dogde and more. Usually this resource is limited and thus sparse. When you have a lower base rate of let us say -80% stamina regeneration or even a slight deregeneration when drawing a bow, a +100% bonus is just weird and feels like a cheat.
So what can be done about this? Well, I see you want to keep it in line with the +100% mana reg from apprentice and +100% hp reg from the lady. There is no need for that with the apprentice i think, though, as there it comes with a heavy downside. The hp reg and stamina reg bonuses could easily be reduced to +20% instead, which is still a lot for stamina, but makes sense as a bonus. They could be +100% while out of combat. If you then wanted a +20% mana reg on some sign, maybe put it on ritual? Would even make some sense to give it +100% out of combat, too (rituals vs battle spells). And to compensate for the weaker lady sign, you could buff it otherwise a bit.
Hmm, as far as I remember there is an additional fraction multiplier in the game that reduces in-combat regen of each attribute. so a +100% is added to the base regen, then when in combat you get whatever fraction of that regen, something like 0.35 * Base regen. At least that how I'd expect this to work. If it doesn't then I should take a look into it, but that's what the vanilla game does I know some mods set the combat regen to 0, so that no amount of buff on base regen would help you in combat.
What you made me realise is that only Magicka Regen boost comes with a balancing negative effect. Whereas stamina and health regen are basically free. Anyways, I probably shall revisit this mod and address a few concerns that were mentioned in the comments.
Ah, now I see how you got the idea with the +50% as balance, which would multiplied by that vanilla in combat factor result in something seemingly similar. However, if the combat mods are based around a certain stamina regeneration, then doubling regeneration is still extreme, no matter what the base value doubled may be and what factors otherwise contributed to it. However, I do see why further increasing out of combat values is indeed not that much of a boon. What might be an idea is to limit the increased regeneration to low values like +20% reg always and additional +20% reg while under 50% of stamina/hp or something along those lines. Otherwise you could of course go for a route like with the apprentice sign and give a high buff with some debuff, but it would have to make sense with the lore rather than being just a balancing factor. Still I am positive you would also come up with something fitting in case of the latter.
And good thing that you found some inspiration in my words as to how to rebalance some stuff. I'll make sure to check out any updates.
I think that in case of such conflict between mods that heavily rely on stamina and mods that provide stamina regen the best way to deal with those is to tweak that multiplier. The one in question here is fCombatStaminaRegenMult. This could balance the increased base regen.
Yeah, for steed stone I think to pivot from “impatient” notion - something that being impatient could cause. For example being impatient makes you less careful in battle causing you to take 15% more damage out something like that.
Cool, I will check the multiplier in SSEEdit as hotfix for my setup, sounds easy enough to do - thanks for the variable name. And yeah, that idea sound good for the steed stone. That is exactly what i meant by making sense with the lore.
So, I learned that when something in simonrim is not for my tastes, I can come to sasnikol to see if he fixed it kkkkkkkkkk The only thing here, that i think would be a good idea to change is the atronach stone and the apprentice... the atronach stone in lore says "cannot regenerate magicka" so... 100%...and the apprentice stone says "more vulnerable to magicka" so I think 100% is too much...the rest seems to be perfect...
Haha looks like you’re on the same path that I was when decided to create these mods.
I’ve tried to minimize changes to original effects. In particular Apprentice effect is mostly Vanilla, I’ve just added the part where spells are more effective (to emphasize more on “affinity for magicka of all kinds” ) and that nicely balanced the debuff, so while your regen is lower, you also spend less magicka on spells, thus less punished by reduced regen.
As for Atronach, it was mostly a gameplay compromise. The lore clearly states that no regen for you, but it’s just too harsh and would make you relying on random of spell absorption or other means like potions. So -75% is severe enough penalty, but doesn’t completely make you helpless. Even then it was still too heavy debuff, so I increased magicka bonus. I’ve tried playing with 0% magicka regen and it was no fun
Yeah you convinced me kkkkkk I just need to decide now if losing fortify smithing and enchanting is worth in Simon's apothecary so I can move to try to find lore friendly followers (those that are not super models or doesnt have menus inside the dialogue window)... I am trying to create a lore friendly modlist, the type wich if you are just playing for the first time you wouldn't know it is a mod... anyway, thanks a lot for your work, skyrim's mods today in general are getting better and better and you are a part of that my friend.
Thank you it looks like we are looking for the same kind of modlist. True about followers. Also I'm now strongly considering to switch to Spaghetti's overhauls from JK's.. I remember the old days when I was modding frenzy tried to put JK's, Dawn of Skyrim, Expanded cities and who knows what else together... but since then I kinda want just a meaningful changes to places. Spaghetti and Ryn seems to be filling up that niche and I'm happy about it.
I might tease a bit my "very distant future" mod that builds on top of Adamant with Vanilla Perks to make Speech skill tree a bit more useful, without packing it with various Shouts or Bard perks basically making it more social-oriented. You reminded me of it because on of the features there would be to be able to increase follower's limit with one of the perks. Similarly to Leadership, but will work with all followers (even those that are "custom managed").
Oh yes, a more useful speech tree would be a great addition. I really like the idea of the perk allowing you to have one extra follower, all mods here on nexus let you have tens of followers and adds a lot of non lore friendly options in dialogue that I do not like... About the bard stuff, one of the reasons I never tried apocalypse was because of the bard perks in speech tree, in Tes lore bards are just musicians, so I just use skyrim got talent... I didnt play it yet, but it seems to add just the music and economy part of it... no magic.
Skyrim Got Talent! Yes I'm also using it. I have literally the same thoughts regarding all that stuff I was thinking of making an add-on for that unnamed speech mod to tie Skyrim Got Talent skill to some perks, but it's too unique mechanic to be considered Vanilla+, so yeah. Anyways Looks like you gonna like all mods that I'll make, because my main goals are to fill the gaps in my perfect modlist.
P.S. the perk is multi-tired and would allow up to 4 followers depending on you Speech skill (and, obviously, perk rank).
I will already ask for a patch before u even make the mod kkkkkk where the limit of the perk is two... the dungeons in Skyrim are not made for many followers... 2 is the sweet spot, it will allow some conversation (ex: Inigo with Lucien) possible... more than that i feel i am cheating and it stops us, the player, to really conect with a follower if we have too many... Just my opinion of course.
Well, technically you could just not upgrade that perk and stay at it's first rank to be able to recruit only 2 followers But, I hear you. In fact, I myself also not really planning on adventuring with lots of followers at the same time. And to signify their presence I'm using Follower Death and Injury Chance - Followers Can Die, so no immortal followers, which in turn makes each of them special, even if they don't have too deep personality behind them (e.g. generic followers/hirelings)
Kinda late reply, but it sounds like some other mod overwrites the description attached to the "spell" which is granted when you activate standing stones.
Do not understand lots of the resentment here. I think this is a legitimately nice mix that does indeed feel better to me in gameplay, of course i am utilizing this with quite a number of different overhauls but this works, not fond of Standing stone mods that only contain negatives+Postives but adding the negatives on some of the stronger standing stones mantains the balance i want from a standpoint of someone that does switch builds and stones as opposed to a set playstyle throughout the game via expensive but existing perk resets to keep things fresh this just seems to have a more appealing selection i think.
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I love using this standing stone mod more than other ones honestly, but i did have to change some numbers in xEdit for it to fit my game more. I have a question regarding the Atronach stone. So by default Atronach stone reduces magicka regen by 75%, however i wanna make it completely negate magicka regen so that i can only restore it through potions which restore magicka. So is the value 75 in xEdit for Atronach stone the penalty for base magicka regen? And if it is, would changing it to 100 shut down magicka regen completely, even through food or magicka regen potion? And is there any way i can change Tower Stone effect from once per day to twice per day? Thank you.
So for the guardian stones, I do think they should be the simplest of all, as they're kind of the "tutorial" stone. But I think we can give them a little something more so they are not just copies of themselves.
For the Mage, when you read a skill that increases the level of a skill, you get an additional level in the skill (+2 instead of +1)
For the Warrior, when you health goes below 50%, your damage increase by 25%
For the Thief, your bounties cost are reduces by 50%.
And the more complex for the last, the Serpent.
Ok, so the Serpent made me think, it should (in my opinion) be the one who's bonus is statistically better than the others, but also get a counterpart that is also a major disadvantage. Because they are "the most blessed and the most cursed", while that give lots of room for buff and debuff options, I tried to stay close to the in-game Serpent Stone.
In Skyrim, if you wish to join the Stormcloak, you are being sent killing a Ice Spectre (I think that's the name) to a specific place and Gunmar tells you "There's something there that attracts Ice Spectre", surprise surprise it's the stone. So that gave me an idea. What if the "curse" of the Serpent is that they attract danger on themselves ?
The downside: Enemies detection radius are increased by 100%, and you receives 20% more damage from all sources.
The upside: .Augment all your skills by 5.
Edit: Removed the warrior idea, it wasn't really good.
Edit 2: Added a new warrior idea, changed the serpent upside (less complex while still interesting) and added the thieve stone.
I don't know how hard it might be to implement, but I do think its potent and distinguished to not overlap with other stones.
As long as you have a follower with you, both of you (reminder that base game is only 1 follower max) receives a bonus to Magicka/Health/Stamina regeneration by 10%. If that same follower is your wife/husband, it becomes 15%.
So, right now, I'm not sure how it would work if someone were to use more than one follower. Maybe something like "As long as there is one follower, 5% (up to 10%), and if partner is in the group 15% but only for both of you."
If I may suggest something else, when I think "passion" I think of someone invested in a project, meaning putting the work to achieve something. And while their isn't any "jobs" you can partake on, their are thing that let you create item that could be useful for others, the crafting skills. Alchemy, Enchanting and Smithing.
What if, the Lover's stone power augmented by like 10% the potency of potion/poisons you create, the equipment you temper and the magnitude of enchantments ?
After a hard day of work, people are amazed by your dedication... and your muscles.
(25% to Speech for 1 in game hour after smithing)
Also, now that I'm thinking about it, I think those Warrior/Mage/Thief stones already give buffs to crafting skills as those are grouped "by color".
Contextually, the most suitable bonus is indeed a buff to all skills, where whichever skill you pick you are passionate about it, thus being able to advance in that skill faster. But I don't think that Lover's Stone meant that kind of passion
Anyways, Lover's Stone is one of those stones that are harder to find appropriate buff for while staying unique
Thanks for taking time and bounce some ideas around!
That said, your The Steed stone explodes stamina-management based combat gameplay. The Firmament talks about hurrying, but you've effectively doubled the damage output of fighters during combat with this bonus, with no penalty. Unless the authors of the Firmament were imagining people born under the sign of The Steed being so hurried and impatient they cut down their foes twice as fast just to get on with the rest of their plans for the day, it seems like not the lore-intended bonus. It would be perfect though if you made stamina regenerate twice as fast only outside combat!
Good point about stamina
It sounds good on paper at least
But to be honest, I didn’t extensively play test this, so it might be a good idea to halve these bonuses in combat, though I’m not sure yet. I might create a sort of add-on that does it and upload in the optional section.
However that steed sign is utterly imbalanced with as good as any combat mod. Either you have not tested the sign before or are not using such combat mods yourself, so just a short summary: Most of these mods use stamina as the one key resource for taking action in fight, dealing damage, reducing damage taken, allowing for dogde and more. Usually this resource is limited and thus sparse. When you have a lower base rate of let us say -80% stamina regeneration or even a slight deregeneration when drawing a bow, a +100% bonus is just weird and feels like a cheat.
So what can be done about this? Well, I see you want to keep it in line with the +100% mana reg from apprentice and +100% hp reg from the lady. There is no need for that with the apprentice i think, though, as there it comes with a heavy downside. The hp reg and stamina reg bonuses could easily be reduced to +20% instead, which is still a lot for stamina, but makes sense as a bonus. They could be +100% while out of combat. If you then wanted a +20% mana reg on some sign, maybe put it on ritual? Would even make some sense to give it +100% out of combat, too (rituals vs battle spells). And to compensate for the weaker lady sign, you could buff it otherwise a bit.
What you made me realise is that only Magicka Regen boost comes with a balancing negative effect. Whereas stamina and health regen are basically free. Anyways, I probably shall revisit this mod and address a few concerns that were mentioned in the comments.
And good thing that you found some inspiration in my words as to how to rebalance some stuff. I'll make sure to check out any updates.
Yeah, for steed stone I think to pivot from “impatient” notion - something that being impatient could cause. For example being impatient makes you less careful in battle causing you to take 15% more damage out something like that.
I’ve tried to minimize changes to original effects. In particular Apprentice effect is mostly Vanilla, I’ve just added the part where spells are more effective (to emphasize more on “affinity for magicka of all kinds” ) and that nicely balanced the debuff, so while your regen is lower, you also spend less magicka on spells, thus less punished by reduced regen.
As for Atronach, it was mostly a gameplay compromise. The lore clearly states that no regen for you, but it’s just too harsh and would make you relying on random of spell absorption or other means like potions. So -75% is severe enough penalty, but doesn’t completely make you helpless. Even then it was still too heavy debuff, so I increased magicka bonus.
I might tease a bit my "very distant future" mod that builds on top of Adamant with Vanilla Perks to make Speech skill tree a bit more useful, without packing it with various Shouts or Bard perks
P.S. the perk is multi-tired and would allow up to 4 followers depending on you Speech skill (and, obviously, perk rank).
I'd assume that by the time when Magicka bonus falls off the primary mage skills take over.
And they always provide spell cost reduction.
Anyways, I've left the old version for the time being if you prefer it over the new one.
I think this is a legitimately nice mix that does indeed feel better to me in gameplay, of course i am utilizing this with quite a number of different overhauls but this works, not fond of Standing stone mods that only contain negatives+Postives but adding the negatives on some of the stronger standing stones mantains the balance i want from a standpoint of someone that does switch builds and stones as opposed to a set playstyle throughout the game via expensive but existing perk resets to keep things fresh this just seems to have a more appealing selection i think.