Okay, here's the resolution, I've uploaded version 1.1, in which all attempts to stifle the horse's health regeneration have been scrapped. What's left is, when the horse has less than 50% health, then stamina drains... (and just as before, if stamina drains to 0, the limp effect from CH kicks in), and that's all the mod will do in version 1.1. Disappointed to settle for this, but it should be stable, reliable, and consistent at least.
I like the idea of this mod as complementary to other mods. It brings the realism of the issue of putting your horse in a dangerous situation, especially since once it starts taking damage enough, it won't be able to flee effectively, very much like real life.
Open question for anyone who still is interested in the idea of this mod...
Now that the fatal flaws of version 1.0 have been resolved and I believe version 1.1 is stable, my issue is that we are kind of back to square one as far as (at least in my opinion) my horse feels practically invincible again, because it's health regenerates like a troll, so it will be a rare occasion that it's health ever gets under 50% which is the only thing that allows this mod to actually do its thing...
SO, here's my question, what would you guys think about kicking the stamina drain in at, say, like 98% health? So, in practice, anytime your horse gets hit by an enemy, it's stamina would begin to drain, and would continue to drain until the horses health gets back to full... (Which would be fairly quickly assuming the horse doesn't get hit again, but if it takes multiple hits, the stamina would continue to drain for a bit, potentially actually becoming meaningful if you are in a real dog fight...)
I'm just thinking out loud here, I might try the above tweak on my own game tonight to see how it goes, but if anyone else has any thoughts feel free to share!
Yeah I was thinking that might be the case. I'm not able to look at other mods right now, and I don't know how to do the SPID stuff, but what I will do is post a couple more files with lesser health regen nerf, to POSSIBLY work without CH... ~dan
Yeah, I'm not too savvy with SPID, and Skypatcher myself when it comes to the nuts and bolts, but they do make modding much more convenient nowadays on the patching side. Also, that would be really awesome of you to post some more versions of your mod, I'll def give them a once over and let you know what I find.
Test A: is the same as the main version for those of us that do not have CH, health drain starts immediately and does not stop.
Test B: starts out well, health holds steady until you pass the 50% threshold then unfortunately its a slow drain to inevitable death or if your horse is protected like mine then its alive and follows you around but you're unable to ride them and their health stays below 0. Thats when things get weird. If you heal your horse (I used a potion) but its health is still below the 50% mark, then the health and stamina drain starts all over again. A suggestion if I may, would be to remove the drain effect at the 50% mark and go with a blanket 0 for health and stamina regen for a set amount of time. Like 30 seconds or 5 minutes or maybe even randomize it. I think that might help with the messiness of trying to get the right drain percentage.
Thanks for that info! Question... On test B... When you say health holds steady (before passing the 50% mark), does it literally just "hold", like, not go up or down? Or is it a slow regeneration? I need that specific info and then can probably get it calibrated for you.
EDIT- In headed to bed, but check out test C if you get a chance, I'm curious what that one will do! ~dan
I stickied a new post, but just pasting to you as well...
"UPDATE - There are now 2 main files... 1) The original (v1.0) (which is intended to use with Convenient Horses installed) 2) version 1.0v, which is intended for use WITHOUT Convenient Horses installed. (This was formerly called "Test C" in my experimental optional files). I have now tested this version on a clean vanilla install and can confirm it works properly in all aspects (minus the "limp" when "injured"), and does NOT drain the horses health down."
Hey, you got another file uploaded. Fantastic news cant wait to give it run. Thanks for sharing this with the rest of us deviants who do not use CH. Much appreciated Dan.
Hey, if I'm going to injure your horse, you may as well injure me... I just found your "Wildcat - Ruin in Perpetuum", ha, looks sweet, I'm going to try that out! (I already use wildcat, so should work smooth... Thanks for your feedbacK (AND your work!) ~dan
Call me a wimp, I did the "piece of cake version" and tweaked the times down further from 1800 to 1200 seconds, however I did bump the Magicka drain back up a tad... and also added a "speed penalty" to the spine injury... (and my excuse for being a wimp is the enemies and overall difficulty of my game is already INSANE), but yeah, I'm definitely looking forward to the additional, well... pain, haha, going forward! Thanks again my friend!
Totally welcome, I sometimes think that the reason I mod Skyrim is just to make the game unplayably difficult. And I like the adds and subs you made. Ha! I kind of wish I thought of that speed nerf. That's a great add. Also watch out for the leg injury trip, it can be more deadly to followers than Dragons :)
As a thought to allow for more compatibility, would it be a possibility to use SPID to distribute the keyword to Skyrim's horses, or SkyPatcher? That way you don't have to manually edit the npc record.
UPDATE - There are now 2 main files... 1) The original (v1.0) (which is intended to use with Convenient Horses installed) 2) version 1.0v, which is intended for use WITHOUT Convenient Horses installed. (This was formerly called "Test C" in my experimental optional files). I have now tested this version on a clean vanilla install and can confirm it works properly in all aspects (minus the "limp" when "injured"), and does NOT drain the horses health down. It only drains STAMINA down (when horse is below 50% health), and slows health regeneration,etc...
I've been looking for something along these lines! It's a bit ridiculous that they can just canter forever. I'm not running Convenient Horses, but I'll let you know if I notice anything weird.
Thanks, yeah just a heads up the way I nerfed the health regen is by way of a health drain, which is less than the rate of the normal regen (at least with CH installed), because CH has so many scripts and stuff and it's too complex for me, and I'm not even sure if CH has it's own forced horse health regen rate forced in, or if it's just vanilla that regenerates horses like trolls, so as I said I'm not sure what to expect with vanilla... But let me know! ~dan
24 comments
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Okay, here's the resolution, I've uploaded version 1.1, in which all attempts to stifle the horse's health regeneration have been scrapped. What's left is, when the horse has less than 50% health, then stamina drains... (and just as before, if stamina drains to 0, the limp effect from CH kicks in), and that's all the mod will do in version 1.1. Disappointed to settle for this, but it should be stable, reliable, and consistent at least.
Sorry for my difficulties with this one.
================================
~dan
Now that the fatal flaws of version 1.0 have been resolved and I believe version 1.1 is stable, my issue is that we are kind of back to square one as far as (at least in my opinion) my horse feels practically invincible again, because it's health regenerates like a troll, so it will be a rare occasion that it's health ever gets under 50% which is the only thing that allows this mod to actually do its thing...
SO, here's my question, what would you guys think about kicking the stamina drain in at, say, like 98% health? So, in practice, anytime your horse gets hit by an enemy, it's stamina would begin to drain, and would continue to drain until the horses health gets back to full... (Which would be fairly quickly assuming the horse doesn't get hit again, but if it takes multiple hits, the stamina would continue to drain for a bit, potentially actually becoming meaningful if you are in a real dog fight...)
I'm just thinking out loud here, I might try the above tweak on my own game tonight to see how it goes, but if anyone else has any thoughts feel free to share!
~dan
Can confirm that it does not work well without CH, the added perk slowly drains all the health out of the horse.
~dan
I lowered the counterbalancing health-drain on test A (to hopefully allow vanilla health regen to override it... (and lowered it further on test B)
If you (or anyone) tries it, please report back. Only through feedback will I be able to tweak further...
Thanks!
~dan
Edit: Holy crap that was fast :)
Test A: is the same as the main version for those of us that do not have CH, health drain starts immediately and does not stop.
Test B: starts out well, health holds steady until you pass the 50% threshold then unfortunately its a slow drain to inevitable death or if your horse is protected like mine then its alive and follows you around but you're unable to ride them and their health stays below 0. Thats when things get weird. If you heal your horse (I used a potion) but its health is still below the 50% mark, then the health and stamina drain starts all over again. A suggestion if I may, would be to remove the drain effect at the 50% mark and go with a blanket 0 for health and stamina regen for a set amount of time. Like 30 seconds or 5 minutes or maybe even randomize it. I think that might help with the messiness of trying to get the right drain percentage.
Hope this helps
EDIT- In headed to bed, but check out test C if you get a chance, I'm curious what that one will do!
~dan
"UPDATE - There are now 2 main files...
1) The original (v1.0) (which is intended to use with Convenient Horses installed)
2) version 1.0v, which is intended for use WITHOUT Convenient Horses installed. (This was formerly called "Test C" in my experimental optional files). I have now tested this version on a clean vanilla install and can confirm it works properly in all aspects (minus the "limp" when "injured"), and does NOT drain the horses health down."
~dan
Thanks for your feedbacK (AND your work!)
~dan
that reminds me there's a patch I want to put up for that mod.
Thanks again my friend!
And if you want to take that idea and add it to your mod (the speed penalty on spine injury), feel free! If anything I'd be honored.
Anyways, great talking, and sharing our creations with each other, better get back to modding-it-til-breaks... Err, I mean playing some Skyrim... 😂
Great idea though I agree!
~dan
1) The original (v1.0) (which is intended to use with Convenient Horses installed)
2) version 1.0v, which is intended for use WITHOUT Convenient Horses installed. (This was formerly called "Test C" in my experimental optional files). I have now tested this version on a clean vanilla install and can confirm it works properly in all aspects (minus the "limp" when "injured"), and does NOT drain the horses health down. It only drains STAMINA down (when horse is below 50% health), and slows health regeneration,etc...
Thanks!
~dan
~dan