It's kinda not doing much either way, since headshots deal double damage to begin with.
This is why Damage Threshold is meant to be complementary to Damage Resistance, because the latter is much more effective against high-damage attacks on a point-by-point basis than DT, while simultaneously not providing as much additional protection against lower damage attacks.
No i tried making DT and DR 500 from Geck and no still the same amount of damage i take but there is a mod that removes the cap of DT DR and RR so no i am not wrong :)
You don't even understand how the armor system works.
DR caps at 85%. 500 DR does absolutely nothing.
DT subtracts from incoming damage, but cannot reduce an individual attack below 20% of its total damage so again, obscene amounts of DT that no attack from an NPC in the game can dish out will provide no additional protection than if you just had DT equal to the attack's damage..
That would make them more impactful for certain, but you're also just straying in to the territory of why there isn't a body/head armor distinction to begin with.
i still do take damage but when i wear a power armor i do not want a petty powder ganger take half of my health with a butter knife :). Look man your taste is obviously diffrent. you like the hardcore RPG stuff my taste is trying to make the FNV as immersive as possible. when i play as BOS i make the power armor pretty strong. when i play legion i try to be sneaky with sharp and pointy things but them rangers always put a lead on me :) Well all the talk aside its strange you made your arguement point as game design ?? This is modding community man we are here to change the game design :D
Modding is game design, especially mods that are literally about changing the balance of the game.
You were the one making the comment about the armor system being "broken" because the armor system is not designed to provide literal invincibility, because games are typically about providing some level of challenge. It's not broken because there isn't a psuedo-godmode in the game. What *is* broken is having an enemy that you need to kill be indestructible because you thought it would be a good idea to allow 100% Damage Resistance in the game.
A powder ganger cannot hit you for "half your life" in power armor. The strongest weapon they have deals 20 damage, which means even on very hard, the highest they can hit you for is 8 hp when wearing high-dt armor. That's less than a scratch for even a level 1 character with 1 Endurance.
Like i siad man diffrent tastes. something being capped at somewhere is broken IMO. You taking same amount of damage even if you have all specials 10 and all skills 100 and with t-51 power armor is kinda BS in my taste. When i wear power armor i am slow as hell and only heavy explosives can kill me if thats gonna make you feel better in the name balancing :)
No it doesn't how it works man when you wear power armor small arms fire (not lasers) damage you like you are wearing normal armor, becasue of the cap. If you read the fallout lore the power armors are designed to be one man tank. Can you stop tank tank with bullets ?? No. Can you stop tank with explosives?? Yes. so thats how it suppose to work imo.
If you think it's unacceptable to be scratched for 3 damage, just play with God Mode and save yourself a few kbs of harddrive space. The armor system isn't broken just because it isn't literally impossible for you to be killed.
Also, "Lore"? When is the strength of Power Armor Plating ever compared to a Tank, or any other armored vehicle?. For that matter, there is nothing special about Power Armor Plating. It's not made of "Vibranium" or some other fantastical alloy. It's just Steel. No amount of armor protects a human body from the physical force of a high-velocity impact from a high-caliber rifle (which are the only weapons that deal remotely decent damage against Power Armor.) Your bones and flesh would just break and liquefy inside the armor. Steel doesn't stop physics. That's why Maces and other Bludgeoning weapons were invented.
And that's not even going in to the differences of how Tanks and suits of Armor are built. A suit meant to be wearable by a human being will never be as dense as a Tank, which is a glorified Steel Box.
And going beyond that, you do realize that senselessly buffing the armor values like that creates contradictions in the effectiveness of weapons * that in "lore," were specifically created to combat Power Armor*, Such as Pulse Weaponry, Anti-Material and Gauss Rifles? 100% DR affects one weapon the same as any other, which is to say it reduces incoming damage to zero. (No different for Lasers either. I'm not sure why you think they're treated differently by the armor system.)
Umm yea its unacceptable for me that a cayote biting me in power armor and taking away my health lol. And by lore i am talking about fallout lore dude lmao. i know right now in our today's techonology something like power armor is impossible but Fallout is a retrofuturistic world. According yo your lore logic then stimpacks the a mix of chemicals in the air pressured injecture that boosts your wound healing shouldn't exist because after all its impossible to heal a bullet wound in minutes right ? :)
No, the fallout lore is that power armor is made of steel. There is no lore saying that "Fallout Steel" is different than real world steel. For that matter neither is there anything in Fallout lore saying the human body interacts with the forces of gravity and momentum differently.
That's entirely unrelated to the "science" that allows Stimpaks to do what they do.
A coyote would deal as little as 1 damage against Power Armor. That's not enough to even remove a tick from the health bar for a level one character with one endurance. In lore terms, that would translate to the irritation of a coyote bothering you causing your nose to itch. If you actually sat there doing absolutely for the IRL hour it might take for a coyote to kill you in power armor (over a day in-game), than clearly your character had a stroke, aneurysm, or mental breakdown, and that's how "the coyote" killed them.
Just play with god mode. It'll cause a lot less problems than breaking the armor system in the ways you describe.
Umm no its not just normal steel. T-51 quote ''The peak level of military technology''. so its not just steel. So cayote and small arms fire should not make dent on power armor. I am not judging your taste obviously you don't know how bullet ballistics works but i have no idea why power armor being immersive is bothering you lol. If i play on god mode it will be no fun. in my own game power armor can be damaged with explosives
The "peak level of military technology'" in terms of weaponry is the Gauss Rifle. Guess what it's made of? Steel. It's not made of Unobtanium or some other fanciful substance.
What's special about Power is not the Armor, because that's just steel. It's the "Power"ed portion, the servos, power-pack, the fact it's a suit that an individual can wear that make it "The Peak of Military Technology." Literally the advancement between T-45d and T-51b is "servos" that improved the wearer's mobility and ability to handle delicate tasks with their hands. That's why T-45d has an agility penalty.
You're literally playing on God Mode already by removing the damage caps from the armor system. The only difference is that just using a console command would save you a few bytes of memory.
I don't care about how "immersive" you think it is. More your ignorant views on why the armor system is the way it is.
Wow having a diffrent taste is being ignorant now lmao. According to your logic you can play this game on a 2001 made Computer after all your current pc components and 2001 compnents are made of plastic so no diffrent right ? Or you can make wings from steel and don't ever have to book a flight ticket after all the plane is steel and your wings are steel too . You have no idea about Fallout lore or Fallout Bible, I respect your opinion playing the game as MMORPG style damage system but you should really show same courtesy instead of trying to heat the arguement with non making sense bases and insulting people take a chill pill.
i know what i am arguing about and at least i try to show people how can this be changed if they don't like it i am not forcing anybody or insulting other people for having diffrent opinion and yes saying armor system is broken is an opinion you like it or not
No. Saying something is "broken" means it is not doing what it is supposed to do. That is empirically false.
The armor system in NV works the way it does because, as a game, it's meant to be challenging on some level, even if it would take doing literally nothing for an hour for a bottom-tier enemy to kill you while wearing end-tier armor. It's also mean to not put you in a situation in which your game becomes "soft-locked" because you literally cannot damage an enemy.
You still focusing on this on your taste, like i said IMO its broken and its an opinion just like saying something sucks. it can be very suitable for your taste and thats fine by me. But according to your attitude you really have some issues about people enjoying things that you don't. There are thousands of mods trying to make this mod immersive and FPS like or your style trying to make it even more MMORPG style. The important thing is the understandtment between people here not trying heat the arguement.
It has nothing to do with what either of us enjoy. Or what you think I enjoy. You are the one who has brought this irrelevant idea of "preferring immersion/mmorpg" to the discussion.
Your first statement to me was "Armor system is broken/not working at all in NV unfortunately."
That statement is completely false. It is not "broken" because you don't like how it works. (All this nonsense about "taste" is clearly you doing some serious projection.)
Yes i said that because it was my opinion, you are the who said super weapons and armors are just bunch of steels and called me ignorant lmao. thats why i tried to explain it was my taste and i said many times that it was about tastes and i respected yours because some people likes immersion others don't but seems like you are stuck in your temple of self righteousness
Saying something is "Broken" is not an opinion. You are saying that something does not work properly. You are ignorant because you refuse to acknowledge that it is working as designed. Ignorance is not a negative trait. It just means the absence of knowledge or understanding.
An actual negative trait would be Stupidity, and that would be the case if someone were to keep insisting that something working as designed is "broken" because they don't like what it produces.
I don't care what you enjoy, and I understand why you enjoy it, but you want to argue about why the game works the way it does, so spare me your childish nonesense about a "Temple of Self-Rightousness" and accept that there are reasons that things work the way they do, even if you don't like it and want to change them so they don't work that way.
i am not arguing about the way game works Fallout is an RPG no doubt about it and from your third or 4th reply i stopped arguing about it and told about taste . But you are the one who heated and prolonged this arguement and you are the one who made childish nonsene and started insulting people. my first sentence is not an opnion for you but its for me anyway Lets just stop here and be glad this game is moddble cause this arguement is going nowhere Edit: you are just increasing the dosage of your insults over having diffrent opinions. You really need some help i am not gonna argue with someone who thinks they are at reddit or GUNetwork.
Gonna follow up here; @aLp3r, buddy - you gotta stop shouting the equivalent of 'THE SKY IS GREEN!' and then attempt to put up the defense that its 'just my opinion, bro'. I know its been three years and counting since this debate, but here we are three years on and continuing to chuckle at that absurdity.
Forgive me if this sounds obvious but does bLocalizedDTDR from JIP cover just the player or NPCs as well? Furthermore, does this mod cover both player and NPCs?
Please forgive me, but I'm confused. I have JIP installed, but I never changed any settings. In your description it says "when bLlocalizedDTDR is enabled" so if I didn't enable it, then there's no need for this mod? Or is it enabled automatically?
Thank you for the mod and efforts but Armor system is really broken in NV. i even tried making DT and DR 500 and i still get the same amount of damage. its the perks make you resisting against damages
Perhaps because at least 20% (vanilla) damage gets through no matter how high the DT? See https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout:_New_Vegas_combat#Combat_damage
I did hear some issues on performance with it. I may be wrong on that part though. Then again I use already a mod like DT Multiplier and DR Adder, which does job fine for me.
48 comments
This is why Damage Threshold is meant to be complementary to Damage Resistance, because the latter is much more effective against high-damage attacks on a point-by-point basis than DT, while simultaneously not providing as much additional protection against lower damage attacks.
DR caps at 85%. 500 DR does absolutely nothing.
DT subtracts from incoming damage, but cannot reduce an individual attack below 20% of its total damage so again, obscene amounts of DT that no attack from an NPC in the game can dish out will provide no additional protection than if you just had DT equal to the attack's damage..
It's called game balance. Armor isn't supposed to make you or your enemies literally impervious to damage.
If you want to enable 100% Damage Resistance or remove the 20% Minimum of damage from DT, you may as well just play with God Mode.
man your taste is obviously diffrent. you like the hardcore RPG stuff
my taste is trying to make the FNV as immersive as possible. when i
play as BOS i make the power armor pretty strong. when i play legion i
try to be sneaky with sharp and pointy things but them rangers always
put a lead on me :) Well all the talk aside its strange you made your
arguement point as game design ?? This is modding community man we are here
to change the game design :D
You were the one making the comment about the armor system being "broken" because the armor system is not designed to provide literal invincibility, because games are typically about providing some level of challenge. It's not broken because there isn't a psuedo-godmode in the game. What *is* broken is having an enemy that you need to kill be indestructible because you thought it would be a good idea to allow 100% Damage Resistance in the game.
A powder ganger cannot hit you for "half your life" in power armor. The strongest weapon they have deals 20 damage, which means even on very hard, the highest they can hit you for is 8 hp when wearing high-dt armor. That's less than a scratch for even a level 1 character with 1 Endurance.
I just think you would save time by just playing with demigod mode on if you think it's "broken" to be able take damage.
Also, "Lore"?
When is the strength of Power Armor Plating ever compared to a Tank, or any other armored vehicle?. For that matter, there is nothing special about Power Armor Plating. It's not made of "Vibranium" or some other fantastical alloy. It's just Steel.
No amount of armor protects a human body from the physical force of a high-velocity impact from a high-caliber rifle (which are the only weapons that deal remotely decent damage against Power Armor.) Your bones and flesh would just break and liquefy inside the armor. Steel doesn't stop physics. That's why Maces and other Bludgeoning weapons were invented.
And that's not even going in to the differences of how Tanks and suits of Armor are built. A suit meant to be wearable by a human being will never be as dense as a Tank, which is a glorified Steel Box.
And going beyond that, you do realize that senselessly buffing the armor values like that creates contradictions in the effectiveness of weapons * that in "lore," were specifically created to combat Power Armor*, Such as Pulse Weaponry, Anti-Material and Gauss Rifles? 100% DR affects one weapon the same as any other, which is to say it reduces incoming damage to zero. (No different for Lasers either. I'm not sure why you think they're treated differently by the armor system.)
For that matter neither is there anything in Fallout lore saying the human body interacts with the forces of gravity and momentum differently.
That's entirely unrelated to the "science" that allows Stimpaks to do what they do.
A coyote would deal as little as 1 damage against Power Armor. That's not enough to even remove a tick from the health bar for a level one character with one endurance. In lore terms, that would translate to the irritation of a coyote bothering you causing your nose to itch. If you actually sat there doing absolutely for the IRL hour it might take for a coyote to kill you in power armor (over a day in-game), than clearly your character had a stroke, aneurysm, or mental breakdown, and that's how "the coyote" killed them.
Just play with god mode. It'll cause a lot less problems than breaking the armor system in the ways you describe.
What's special about Power is not the Armor, because that's just steel. It's the "Power"ed portion, the servos, power-pack, the fact it's a suit that an individual can wear that make it "The Peak of Military Technology." Literally the advancement between T-45d and T-51b is "servos" that improved the wearer's mobility and ability to handle delicate tasks with their hands. That's why T-45d has an agility penalty.
You're literally playing on God Mode already by removing the damage caps from the armor system. The only difference is that just using a console command would save you a few bytes of memory.
I don't care about how "immersive" you think it is. More your ignorant views on why the armor system is the way it is.
If you're going to argue with me, at least know what you're arguing about.
The armor system in NV works the way it does because, as a game, it's meant to be challenging on some level, even if it would take doing literally nothing for an hour for a bottom-tier enemy to kill you while wearing end-tier armor. It's also mean to not put you in a situation in which your game becomes "soft-locked" because you literally cannot damage an enemy.
Your first statement to me was "Armor system is broken/not working at all in NV unfortunately."
That statement is completely false. It is not "broken" because you don't like how it works. (All this nonsense about "taste" is clearly you doing some serious projection.)
An actual negative trait would be Stupidity, and that would be the case if someone were to keep insisting that something working as designed is "broken" because they don't like what it produces.
I don't care what you enjoy, and I understand why you enjoy it, but you want to argue about why the game works the way it does, so spare me your childish nonesense about a "Temple of Self-Rightousness" and accept that there are reasons that things work the way they do, even if you don't like it and want to change them so they don't work that way.
Edit: you are just increasing the dosage of your insults over having diffrent opinions. You really need some help i am not gonna argue with someone who thinks they are at reddit or GUNetwork.
That's not an insult, that's just literally an alternative method of achieving the same result.
toasted.
I have JIP installed, but I never changed any settings. In your description it says "when bLlocalizedDTDR is enabled" so if I didn't enable it, then there's no need for this mod?
Or is it enabled automatically?
Universal Headwear DT Boost at Fallout New Vegas - mods and community (nexusmods.com)
Thanks for the alternate take on it eitherway :)
Then again I use already a mod like DT Multiplier and DR Adder, which does job fine for me.
Break continues.