I'm wondering how this perk will work with arquebuses? It will be strange if, with their big shots, they knock weapons out of the enemy’s hands, just like ordinary arrows.
I'm sorry but I just looked it up and it's not. According to Bethesda developer Andrew Griffiths: Cartogriffi — 12/05/2023 11:44 AM
Achievements are only permissible when using official content. Content released through the Verified Creator program is reviewed by BGS, but it isn't official. So we're required to disable achievements when using it.
Our lord and savior Arthmoor says restoring this perk is a bad idea because it causes save bloat. I'll be using it anyway because it's cool but it's just something to note.
Hi Deejmaster333! Like any other moved reference its placement is saved in the save file yes. Its only natural that it increases save file size. But so does moving anything else ingame. Calling it bloat feels misleading as it isnt exponentially growing but lineary. The difference is neglible and it only occurs one time. If you move the object again the savefile wont increase further. Just think about all the clutter in the whole game that is on the ground and ask yourself if you would ever disarm as many weapons that this number would become even remotely equal to all the other clutter thats being moved around in the game by Urelenting force shout or stumbling over it etc.
The 2 spell effects from Trick Shot and Bullseye likely will not stack well and might cause game issues. The perk entry of this perk is "Apply Combat Hit Spell", the same as the Bullseye perk.
The latter got around it by making it so Bullseye had the same effect as both Bullseye and Trick Shot and The Trick Shot perk Itself would be disabledwhen you got to Bullseye. The other two mods also note that the weapon was only disarmed if the enemy was attacking you - Is that the case with your version?
Then there is the issue of save game bloat, noted by Arthmor [source: sticky post on Cutting Room Floor] due to the fact that disarming separates the weapon from the NPC and then leaves it behind forever without cleaning it up.
Have you implemented a similar fix to the Working Trick Shot Archery Perk for Oldrim? Have you inputted anything to help with the potential save game bloat?
Your description is quite vague on how this perk was added.
Regarding "Apply Combat Hit Spell": Bullseye and Trickshot both have a very low chance of triggering their effect. Bullseye has a 15% chance and Trickshot has a 25% chance, so the chance for them both trying to apply their effects in a single shot is less than 4% which is insignificant in my eyes. One or the other perk will apply its effects in those rare cases. Or so I thought.. Turns out Trickshot has it's randomness check set up in its magic effect rather than in its perk. Will fix that in an update shortly. Otherwise just use Scrambled Bugs for now.
Regarding Save game bloat: I don't agree with Arthmoor on this one. There is a huge difference between savegame bloat from scripts or overflows that can potentionally spiral out of control in a non-liniar way, while references created from dropped weapons will only increment the savegame size lineary. If you think about how much clutter and objects lie around in vanilla naturally that you knock around that also will create references and compare that to the amount of weapons you could potentially disarm this seems wild to assume savegame bloat. Also consider how often you drop stuff from your inventory somewhere. Besides you can just collect the weapons.
The point of this mod vs. the others is to be as unintrusive as possible. It only changes the Quickshot perk and thats it. Theres no need to create even more compatibility issues by also changing Bullseye or even worse changing the archery tree like the others do. And certainly I won't implement an unimmersive "fix" like ussep that puts the weapon in the npcs inventory on disarm. How would I be able to use it against them that way?
I appriciate the response and happy to hear that you will be looking into a fix for the bullseye/trickshot part of the query - because while 4% is insignificant to you its still a risk for causing issues.
Interesting point on the save game bloat.
As to the point of this mod vs others - if your mod doesnt address the potential bugs that can come with it then there is no point surely? It would just have a 4% chance of something going wrong no? Anyway thanks for linking to the other mod and glad you are working on a fixed
15 comments
Cartogriffi — 12/05/2023 11:44 AM
Long story short: I disagree with arthmoor.
The 2 spell effects from Trick Shot and Bullseye likely will not stack well and might cause game issues. The perk entry of this perk is "Apply Combat Hit Spell", the same as the Bullseye perk.
This issue was noted in the Oldrim Mod: Trick Shot Perk for Archery and a later Oldrim mod was made to fix this issue called Working Trick Shot Archery Perk.
The latter got around it by making it so Bullseye had the same effect as both Bullseye and Trick Shot and The Trick Shot perk Itself would be disabledwhen you got to Bullseye. The other two mods also note that the weapon was only disarmed if the enemy was attacking you - Is that the case with your version?
Then there is the issue of save game bloat, noted by Arthmor [source: sticky post on Cutting Room Floor] due to the fact that disarming separates the weapon from the NPC and then leaves it behind forever without cleaning it up.
Have you implemented a similar fix to the Working Trick Shot Archery Perk for Oldrim? Have you inputted anything to help with the potential save game bloat?
Your description is quite vague on how this perk was added.
Regarding Save game bloat: I don't agree with Arthmoor on this one. There is a huge difference between savegame bloat from scripts or overflows that can potentionally spiral out of control in a non-liniar way, while references created from dropped weapons will only increment the savegame size lineary. If you think about how much clutter and objects lie around in vanilla naturally that you knock around that also will create references and compare that to the amount of weapons you could potentially disarm this seems wild to assume savegame bloat. Also consider how often you drop stuff from your inventory somewhere. Besides you can just collect the weapons.
The point of this mod vs. the others is to be as unintrusive as possible. It only changes the Quickshot perk and thats it. Theres no need to create even more compatibility issues by also changing Bullseye or even worse changing the archery tree like the others do. And certainly I won't implement an unimmersive "fix" like ussep that puts the weapon in the npcs inventory on disarm. How would I be able to use it against them that way?
Interesting point on the save game bloat.
As to the point of this mod vs others - if your mod doesnt address the potential bugs that can come with it then there is no point surely? It would just have a 4% chance of something going wrong no? Anyway thanks for linking to the other mod and glad you are working on a fixed