Future plans: -Maybe add more scrollwriters. i would need to look into how to do this non-disruptively. Possibly also had Campfire support for the scrollwriter as a placeable object. -Be poised to release a Mysticism patch the nanosecond Simon updates Mysticism to have scrolls, which he may not do.
After tinkering with this for a while i have been able to add my own scrolls to the mod, but the list of available spells and scrolls seems to be cheked only when the mod is installed the for the first time. This generates 2 main problems:
1 The spells you know are only cheked the first time and added to the recipes, after that you can only learn new scrolls via disenchanting. 2 You can add you own scrolls to the mod if you know how to use TesEdit or CK, but you wont be able to use them if the mod was already installed in your save.
If only there was an option to "reset" the list or "look" for new spells or scrolls...
Tried disabling Enchanting experience gain due to it being a ridiculous amount even at the lowest possible level, but even at 0.000 I'm still getting enchanting level-ups on making scrolls. Anyone else have this issue?
I think this is a brilliant mod. I use it along with Apollodown's old "Simple Magic Overhaul", which reduces the player's magicka to negative levels until he develops actual magical skill trees, and with my own Immersive Jewelry mod that changes the way enchantments work based on gem and metal type of the item being enchanted. The idea is to have a person who uses "folk" magic, like the regular people of Skyrim, needing to pay attention to material types, writing scrolls to make effects since they don't have much innate magicka, etc.
The only problem is that it's not loading its MCM into the SkyUI menu. I have tried uninstalling, saving, and then reinstalling to let the MCM catch the menu, and it does, but the configurable parts still won't load.
I love this concept, but in my own opinion having to have learned the spell already somewhat defeats the purpose of crafting the scroll... I understand that you might just use it to "save magicka" but for me I wouldn't want to go to the trouble of installing another .esp mod, figuring out how it works, collecting mats, collecting a soul gem (???), going to one of only two places in the world I can actually make scrolls OR carry around even more crap in my inventory.... ALL THESE requirements.... to save some magicka? Ugh.
Love the idea of your mod, but hate the way it's implemented. Not sure if it would be possible or difficult to achieve in the CK, but personally I would prefer a system whereby you learn how to make a scroll after having used it. (I find a firestorm spell, use it in combat... and voila my character has learned that scroll.)
As for using it just to "cheat", well we're PC players, we must exercise self-control and just not cheat. Remember that at any time I have an automatic invincibility spell called TGM, that I never use because it ruins the game. Same for your scrolls... if I find something OP I just won't use it.
Anyway I'll track this for now, thanks for sharing. Hopefully more "quality of life" improvements can be made.
I definitely agree with adding more scroll crafting stations. I had already planned to upload a new version later tonight that should add scrollwriting stations to every major hold. Each scrollwriter also comes with a scroll that allows you to craft scrolls at a distance, which you can craft more of at 50 enchanting. Each scrollwriter is right by the court wizard, so the soul gems should be easy to come by. I admittedly only added that requirement for balancing and because I normally have about a billion filled soul gems just sitting around by mid-game that I want to get rid of, but in a manner that's more useful than selling. I'm planning on updating all the crafting recipes to make the magic skill optional, and I can add the same for soul gems.
I feel like I should mention that all the storage added - the Scroll Storage spaces under the Scrollwriter - refer to a single linked chest, because I also don't want to carry around a lot of materials that I don't need. That's always been true, although I might have left it out of the description.
Thank you for the rest of your feedback. I was already looking into adding more ways to learn to craft scrolls, and I like the mechanic you've presented, although if I implement it in the future, I will probably require more than one casting of a scroll, although I might make that something that can be toggled as well.
Thanks for listening with an open mind More options are always nice.
The way I see it, scrolls - useful scrolls - would be a cool thing to have for someone who doesn't have magic skills... i.e. a thief-type character who has invested all his points into sneak, pickpocket, light armor etc... scrolls would give me more tricks up my sleeve.
Another option that just kind of popped into my head while reading your response was to have *scroll crafters* (npcs) instead of (or in addition to) the scroll crafting stations... You talk to the npc and he offers his services. You provide him/her with the mats he needs and he crafts scrolls for you on the spot. This might take away some of the "OP" aspects of crafting, since you'd have to plan ahead a bit and couldn't just craft what you needed for every fight. Just like in Oblivion you had mages guild members who had enchanting services, well you'd have Winterhold mages who could craft your scrolls, for a fee, providing you had the right mats. And of course he/she could offer you further training to craft your own scrolls as well!
Anyway thanks for listening. I really love this idea in general, I think scrolls are pretty suckish in all ES games and could use some love. I'll be following this mod with great interest!
Yeah, I could definitely use Sergius Turrianus for enchanting services. I don't know if I want to have him straight up sell scrolls, or have the player bring materials and have him craft scrolls. The headcanon I've added for explaining who at Winterhold wanted a scrollwriter already has him liking them, because his whole thing is enchanting. That could work.
A lot of things might be about to change. The main reason I haven't already implemented a lot of the things that have been suggested is that it requires making multiple copies of each scroll recipe, which I really don't want to do, since I think I have upwards of a hundred between all the different patches. But MXPF might change all that. I think I can implement your casting idea too, and the stamina drain mentioned below. There are a lot of options I have now.
Just a thought: what if the Quill itself was the crafting station? Say there was a script that would let you activate the Quill from your inventory, and provided that you also had a Roll of Paper and an Inkwell in your inventory, it would pull up a special "Scribe" menu. That way, you could do your scribing anywhere.
Just my two cents. This mod looks very interesting; I'm gonna have to try it out soon.
I think the problem of the already know the spell why in the wold do i need the scroll can simple be solved by increasing the effectiveness of the spell, you know for example if you know the fireball spell you can craft a scroll for that and it could make more damage
Just trying this out and was a bit confused by the description where you start off:
To learn or create new scrolls, you will need to use a Scrollwriter or a Scroll of Inscribing
Perhaps rewriting that might help challenged folks like me, such as "To learn how to create a scroll, you will need to use the Scrollwriter" since as far as I can tell you can't learn how to create a scroll using a Scroll of Inscribing. Then follow that with something like "To create new scrolls, you can either use the Scrollwriter or 'cast' using the Scroll of Inscribing." Just trying to say that the way it's currently written isn't exactly clear and I had to actually go in-game to figure out what you meant.
Also a few questions/comments regarding that. First off, I was expecting to be able to 'disenchant' scrolls in much the same way one would do so for items, but it seems it is an all-or-nothing affair and only when you first activate the workstation (something you might also want to note in the description). Is it not technically possible to have this work similarly to the Arcane Enchanter workstation? Regarding the 'Scroll of Inscribing' - i was expecting to either use this as an 'ingredient' at the workstation or 'use' it from my inventory - was a bit surprised when it turned out I had to actually "cast" it as if I was using a scroll - and of course when I canceled that action, I lost the scroll. Is it at all possible to use one of the other methods I mentioned for this instead, and barring that - at least not have it use up the scroll if you do not actually create a new one? Either way - that information might be helpful in the description as well, unless I completely missed it.
Apologies if I missed any of this information - thanks!
EDIT: I suppose it was kind of silly of me to be surprised I had to 'cast' the Inscribing scroll, after all, it is a scroll...and also that I'd expect it to be a component, since that'd just be an extra step and the purpose seems to be for when you aren't near the workstation - also I am guessing checking whether you actually created a new scroll from it isn't easily done to prevent it from being consumed in the event you elected not to... Speaking of which, I'll ask another dumb question - why create ink instead of just using the existing inkwell object as a component, with a recipe to create that instead (if you create ink you still need to put it in something) ?
EDIT 2: Forgot to ask - noticed that for some of the scrolls, you're either adding a charge time or reverting it where USLEEP removed it - wondering why that's the case as it's not mentioned in the description.
my changes to scrolls were based on comparing them to the actual spells. USLEEP reversions are intentional, and not noted explicitly in the description because it's a part of bringing the scroll inline with the spell. ink is used because it weighs less than inkwells, and while I prefer to include it to require some resource, I don't want carrying the resource to be a limiting or annoying factor for the player.
Thanks for the reply and your explanations, truly appreciated - and apologies if any of that came off as critical, if so - it wasn't intentional, just trying to figure things 'out loud' I guess, asking some inane questions along the way and making silly suggestions to accommodate dumba**ses like myself.
Dear EpicCrab, I know that you said you won't update this mod, but I have a few questions that you are fully authorized to ignore (but I hope you won't). 1. One of the merged versions contains the "Scrolls Don't Suck" mod. You updated that mod to ver. 1.02 on 17.01.16, but as far as I can see, here it's still version 1. 2. I really like the idea of scrolls weighing 0.1 instead of 0.5 (as seen here http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/26959/?).
My questions are: could you please update the merged version? can you pretty please with sugar on top add a lightweight version? can I do it myself?
Dear God, thanks for not replying to this nonsense. First of all, the "Scrolls Don't Suck" version is correct here, there is no error in the Mass Paralysis scroll. Second, I sure as f*ck can edit the weight of scrolls myself, jesus. Thanks, TESVEdit
1. This is brilliant idea. Good implementation. I love this mod, and im using it for my "Alchemist/Engineer/Artificer or something" playthrough.
2. Idea of using soul gem is logical - sadly, you can use same item, so, same amount of effort, power, etc, to charge a magical staff. It would be more logical [I think?], if you could split the energy in soulgem between few scrolls. So, for example, you can craft 12 novice scrolls, or 6 apprentice, or 3 adept with a gem; smaller one wil give you 4 novice, 2 apprentice etc. I know it would be annoying to make recipes this way, also, time consuming as hell. [i know it was suggested before, just saying]
3. Suggestion: maybe, you could introduce something like "soulshards" which are crafted from full soulgems, which are then used to craft scrolls? Then, regardless of base gem type you will have same amount of recipes; one gem can create few scrolls, or, in case of powerful spells, you can write master scroll with few smaller soulgems as power source. This is all based on fact that, well, one soulgem can fuel staff for X spells equivalent to scroll, and even if paper is less efficient as a magical medium, it should be possible to "extract" a bit more.
4. Also, Windhelm's scroll storage linked reference is other than rest; changing other crafting stations' references in CK to same as Windhelm [Scrollwriter Cell, Storage something] makes them all open same "chest" with all deposited scrolls/materials.
This is pretty nice, but it's just too much work for a few scrolls. If you're a warrior with only 100 points of Magicka, the benefit of scrolls is that you can cast three fireballs instead of one. This mod makes the scrolls obtainable with wood, ore, paper, a spell tome, and a soul gem. A smart warrior brews one extend magicka potion, two potions of magicka, and drinks them to let him cast high-level spells and refill his magicka inbetween shots. Takes less time and gives you the same result, get what I mean?
So I'm not sure if this is possible, but I think I have a solution; make a slider in the mod menu that lets you make the number of scrolls per "craft" higher. If all those materials were good for something like seven scrolls, it would be worth the hassle.
You can't play a true (morrowind) sorcerer in skyrim without writing your own scrolls, so i hope you keep this mod up. A little idea: Since using a soul gem for scroll writing is correct lore-wise, but scrolls aren't that powerful versus enchanted items, a powerful enchanter can make two scrolls out of one soulgem?
49 comments
-Maybe add more scrollwriters. i would need to look into how to do this non-disruptively. Possibly also had Campfire support for the scrollwriter as a placeable object.
-Be poised to release a Mysticism patch the nanosecond Simon updates Mysticism to have scrolls, which he may not do.
1 The spells you know are only cheked the first time and added to the recipes, after that you can only learn new scrolls via disenchanting.
2 You can add you own scrolls to the mod if you know how to use TesEdit or CK, but you wont be able to use them if the mod was already installed in your save.
If only there was an option to "reset" the list or "look" for new spells or scrolls...
getting enchanting level-ups on making scrolls. Anyone else have this issue?
The only problem is that it's not loading its MCM into the SkyUI menu. I have tried uninstalling, saving, and then reinstalling to let the MCM catch the menu, and it does, but the configurable parts still won't load.
Love the idea of your mod, but hate the way it's implemented. Not sure if it would be possible or difficult to achieve in the CK, but personally I would prefer a system whereby you learn how to make a scroll after having used it. (I find a firestorm spell, use it in combat... and voila my character has learned that scroll.)
As for using it just to "cheat", well we're PC players, we must exercise self-control and just not cheat. Remember that at any time I have an automatic invincibility spell called TGM, that I never use because it ruins the game. Same for your scrolls... if I find something OP I just won't use it.
Anyway I'll track this for now, thanks for sharing. Hopefully more "quality of life" improvements can be made.
I feel like I should mention that all the storage added - the Scroll Storage spaces under the Scrollwriter - refer to a single linked chest, because I also don't want to carry around a lot of materials that I don't need. That's always been true, although I might have left it out of the description.
Thank you for the rest of your feedback. I was already looking into adding more ways to learn to craft scrolls, and I like the mechanic you've presented, although if I implement it in the future, I will probably require more than one casting of a scroll, although I might make that something that can be toggled as well.
The way I see it, scrolls - useful scrolls - would be a cool thing to have for someone who doesn't have magic skills... i.e. a thief-type character who has invested all his points into sneak, pickpocket, light armor etc... scrolls would give me more tricks up my sleeve.
Another option that just kind of popped into my head while reading your response was to have *scroll crafters* (npcs) instead of (or in addition to) the scroll crafting stations... You talk to the npc and he offers his services. You provide him/her with the mats he needs and he crafts scrolls for you on the spot. This might take away some of the "OP" aspects of crafting, since you'd have to plan ahead a bit and couldn't just craft what you needed for every fight. Just like in Oblivion you had mages guild members who had enchanting services, well you'd have Winterhold mages who could craft your scrolls, for a fee, providing you had the right mats. And of course he/she could offer you further training to craft your own scrolls as well!
Anyway thanks for listening. I really love this idea in general, I think scrolls are pretty suckish in all ES games and could use some love. I'll be following this mod with great interest!
Cheers.
A lot of things might be about to change. The main reason I haven't already implemented a lot of the things that have been suggested is that it requires making multiple copies of each scroll recipe, which I really don't want to do, since I think I have upwards of a hundred between all the different patches. But MXPF might change all that. I think I can implement your casting idea too, and the stamina drain mentioned below. There are a lot of options I have now.
Just my two cents. This mod looks very interesting; I'm gonna have to try it out soon.
Just trying this out and was a bit confused by the description where you start off:
Perhaps rewriting that might help challenged folks like me, such as "To learn how to create a scroll, you will need to use the Scrollwriter" since as far as I can tell you can't learn how to create a scroll using a Scroll of Inscribing. Then follow that with something like "To create new scrolls, you can either use the Scrollwriter or 'cast' using the Scroll of Inscribing." Just trying to say that the way it's currently written isn't exactly clear and I had to actually go in-game to figure out what you meant.
Also a few questions/comments regarding that. First off, I was expecting to be able to 'disenchant' scrolls in much the same way one would do so for items, but it seems it is an all-or-nothing affair and only when you first activate the workstation (something you might also want to note in the description). Is it not technically possible to have this work similarly to the Arcane Enchanter workstation? Regarding the 'Scroll of Inscribing' - i was expecting to either use this as an 'ingredient' at the workstation or 'use' it from my inventory - was a bit surprised when it turned out I had to actually "cast" it as if I was using a scroll - and of course when I canceled that action, I lost the scroll. Is it at all possible to use one of the other methods I mentioned for this instead, and barring that - at least not have it use up the scroll if you do not actually create a new one? Either way - that information might be helpful in the description as well, unless I completely missed it.
Apologies if I missed any of this information - thanks!
EDIT: I suppose it was kind of silly of me to be surprised I had to 'cast' the Inscribing scroll, after all, it is a scroll...and also that I'd expect it to be a component, since that'd just be an extra step and the purpose seems to be for when you aren't near the workstation - also I am guessing checking whether you actually created a new scroll from it isn't easily done to prevent it from being consumed in the event you elected not to... Speaking of which, I'll ask another dumb question - why create ink instead of just using the existing inkwell object as a component, with a recipe to create that instead (if you create ink you still need to put it in something) ?
EDIT 2: Forgot to ask - noticed that for some of the scrolls, you're either adding a charge time or reverting it where USLEEP removed it - wondering why that's the case as it's not mentioned in the description.
ink is used because it weighs less than inkwells, and while I prefer to include it to require some resource, I don't want carrying the resource to be a limiting or annoying factor for the player.
I know that you said you won't update this mod, but I have a few questions that you are fully authorized to ignore (but I hope you won't).
1. One of the merged versions contains the "Scrolls Don't Suck" mod. You updated that mod to ver. 1.02 on 17.01.16, but as far as I can see, here it's still version 1.
2. I really like the idea of scrolls weighing 0.1 instead of 0.5 (as seen here http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/26959/?).
My questions are:
could you please update the merged version?
can you pretty please with sugar on top add a lightweight version?
can I do it myself?
First of all, the "Scrolls Don't Suck" version is correct here, there is no error in the Mass Paralysis scroll.
Second, I sure as f*ck can edit the weight of scrolls myself, jesus. Thanks, TESVEdit
2. Idea of using soul gem is logical - sadly, you can use same item, so, same amount of effort, power, etc, to charge a magical staff. It would be more logical [I think?], if you could split the energy in soulgem between few scrolls. So, for example, you can craft 12 novice scrolls, or 6 apprentice, or 3 adept with a gem; smaller one wil give you 4 novice, 2 apprentice etc. I know it would be annoying to make recipes this way, also, time consuming as hell. [i know it was suggested before, just saying]
3. Suggestion: maybe, you could introduce something like "soulshards" which are crafted from full soulgems, which are then used to craft scrolls? Then, regardless of base gem type you will have same amount of recipes; one gem can create few scrolls, or, in case of powerful spells, you can write master scroll with few smaller soulgems as power source. This is all based on fact that, well, one soulgem can fuel staff for X spells equivalent to scroll, and even if paper is less efficient as a magical medium, it should be possible to "extract" a bit more.
4. Also, Windhelm's scroll storage linked reference is other than rest; changing other crafting stations' references in CK to same as Windhelm [Scrollwriter Cell, Storage something] makes them all open same "chest" with all deposited scrolls/materials.
So I'm not sure if this is possible, but I think I have a solution; make a slider in the mod menu that lets you make the number of scrolls per "craft" higher. If all those materials were good for something like seven scrolls, it would be worth the hassle.
You can't play a true (morrowind) sorcerer in skyrim without writing your own scrolls, so i hope you keep this mod up.
A little idea: Since using a soul gem for scroll writing is correct lore-wise, but scrolls aren't that powerful versus enchanted items, a powerful enchanter can make two scrolls out of one soulgem?