Are the 2.0 changes forwarded to the 'Separate Reputation Fix' file? I use mods for Imperial Legion + Fighters Guild, but Thieves Guild + Tribunal/Bloodmoon would be perfect. If not, is the 'full' 2.0 version compatible with other mods like Imperial Legion Expansion and Fighters Guild Improved, or would using both this mod alongside those give 2x the intended reputation points?
Awesome mod! I'm surprised this oversight has never been fixed in all the years. Great job! :) It would indeed be cool if Reputation actually had more uses other than skipping some tedious part of the main quest. Maybe if it would actually affect persuasion skills like Speechcraft (especially Intimidate) or mercantile?
Hi, thank you for the mod! I like that you added reputation gains to DLCs. Will you create a separate version for them, like you did for vanilla factions?
Also, I am not sure that "The Mad God" quest should give you +5 reputation. If you talk to NPCs after finishing Tribunal, nobody will believe that you found Sotha Sil dead and killed Almalexia. Only few people in Morrowind will know what happened during this quest.
I might separate them if others express interest. Those files got barely any downloads so I kinda assumed no one wanted them.
As for Mad God, I thought of that as well, but it's in a weird place where extremely important people will know (Vivec and the King if you didn't kill them for example) the hands have to know something is up, but as you said the common people don't know.
In the end, I decided that the after you are done with the main quest, either all of your deeds you did throughout Tribunal would start to spread more, or people would hear rumors about Almalexia.
Either way, totally see where you're coming from and if other people think it should be less, or that the reputation should be gained elsewhere (maybe meeting Almalexia?) then it'd be an easy change.
Separate plugins provide better compatibility with other mods which edit quest rewards or add alternative solutions, so it would be great if you updated this version.
I see your point about the Mad God quest, perhaps you are right about it. I can suggest you to add reputation gains when you discuss Almalexia's death with Vivec, Helseth or anyone else who knows the truth.
Would love to see this expanded to the DLC. You'd think meeting Almalexia would get people talking and improve your reputation but apparently not according to UESP.
That's not a bad idea. The only sad thing is post-main quest reputation does almost nothing (probably exactly why the devs forgot about it), but that would be very easy to add, and at least it'd be consistent. I'll try and add some reputation in to the DLCs when I get some free time.
Aye true, only noticed because I'm purposefully doing the questlines out of sync to see all the differences (And also to see if the story can remain at least semi-consistent while RPing that way) myself and was kinda aiming to be at 50 reputation by the time I got out of Tribunal.
(edit: These issues have been fixed, so don't use my edited version anymore.)
This seems essential to me. I can't believe it hasn't been done before.
I saw a few issues with the plugin, so I whipped up a fixed version here. Cain if you want to upload this or modify it however please do. (Only the combined version is included, not the modular ones.)
Mostly it incorporates a few fixes from PFP:
- "Bitter Cup" dialogue entry: Fixed typo in dialogue text.
- "Rufinus Alleius" dialogue entries: Added requirement that "Vandacia's Bounty" be completed.
- "slander" dialogue entry: Added requirement that "Honthjolf is a Traitor" be completed.
It also removes references to the topics "Eydis Fire-Eye" and "Madura Seran" - these topics were marked as modified in the plugin even though none of their dialogue entries were actually modified.
The last change was because of an issue in "sjoringScript". tl;dr explanation in spoiler tag.
Spoiler:
Show
This one was hard, considering how complicated the interaction between the quests requiring you to kill Sjoring Hard-Heart is.
The issue is that the script in the original plugin awarded +2 reputation when you kill Sjoring, as long as you're at least guardian rank in the FG. This was intended to be awarded for completing Sjoring's "Kill the Master Thief" quest to kill Jim Stacey.
But it would also be awarded if you kill Sjoring as part of Percius' "Kill Hard-Heart" quest (you have to be guardian rank to receive that quest in the first place). So killing Sjoring for Percius would award you +2 immediately upon killing him, then +3 upon reporting to Percius, for +5 total (and then potentially another +2 from Jim Stacey, for +7 total).
There were a few potential solutions that turned out to be inadequate due to this being way too complicated.
My eventual solution was to use a global variable to ensure that only one of these sources of reputation (the script on Sjoring, and Percius' dialogue) can be earned. But this led to another problem. If you're on Percius's quest to kill Sjoring, you'll get the +2 from the script when killing him, which means you'll be out an intended 1 point because you'll get nothing from Percius. And we can't remove the +3 from Percius' dialogue because the player might kill Sjoring before reaching guardian rank, then rank up, get the quest from Percius, and get no rep at all.
So, I also changed the script's award to +3 instead of +2, so you'll always get +3 whether you're on the quest from Percius or Sjoring. I also removed the +1 from completing Sjoring's "Remove the Heads of the Thieves Guild" quest, so you won't earn +4 from that route. Basically Sjoring's two quests are chained together like Percius' two quests are, which is also more consistent.
This way you'll always earn +3 (no more and no less) upon killing Sjoring for an FG quest. And you can still get the +2 from Stacey as well if you're in the Thieves' Guild.
This is a super complicated case, and I haven't actually tested this in-game, so I might be missing something. If I messed something up here please let me know.
Thanks! Yea I looked everywhere before making this, was kind of shocked it didn't already exist. I get the feeling people kind of forget that the reputation system exists at all since it doesn't do a ton.
Oof, yea I had a feeling there would be some way to cheese some more reputation from the Sjoring quests. This seems like a solid solution to me, at the very least less obviously cheese-able. I'll reupload with your new file (with credit to you of course).
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If you use the full version, and put it before those in your load order they shouldn't double though.
It would indeed be cool if Reputation actually had more uses other than skipping some tedious part of the main quest. Maybe if it would actually affect persuasion skills like Speechcraft (especially Intimidate) or mercantile?
Also, I am not sure that "The Mad God" quest should give you +5 reputation. If you talk to NPCs after finishing Tribunal, nobody will believe that you found Sotha Sil dead and killed Almalexia. Only few people in Morrowind will know what happened during this quest.
As for Mad God, I thought of that as well, but it's in a weird place where extremely important people will know (Vivec and the King if you didn't kill them for example) the hands have to know something is up, but as you said the common people don't know.
In the end, I decided that the after you are done with the main quest, either all of your deeds you did throughout Tribunal would start to spread more, or people would hear rumors about Almalexia.
Either way, totally see where you're coming from and if other people think it should be less, or that the reputation should be gained elsewhere (maybe meeting Almalexia?) then it'd be an easy change.
I see your point about the Mad God quest, perhaps you are right about it. I can suggest you to add reputation gains when you discuss Almalexia's death with Vivec, Helseth or anyone else who knows the truth.
It'll take a hot second, but I'll work on those seperate ones when I get a sec.
if (<global variable> == 0)
set <global variable> to 1
player->modreputation X
endif
You can open the console an type player->set Reputation [value] to set your reputation to what it would have been with this mod though.
This seems essential to me. I can't believe it hasn't been done before.
I saw a few issues with the plugin, so I whipped up a fixed version here. Cain if you want to upload this or modify it however please do. (Only the combined version is included, not the modular ones.)
Mostly it incorporates a few fixes from PFP:
- "Bitter Cup" dialogue entry: Fixed typo in dialogue text.
- "Rufinus Alleius" dialogue entries: Added requirement that "Vandacia's Bounty" be completed.
- "slander" dialogue entry: Added requirement that "Honthjolf is a Traitor" be completed.
It also removes references to the topics "Eydis Fire-Eye" and "Madura Seran" - these topics were marked as modified in the plugin even though none of their dialogue entries were actually modified.
The last change was because of an issue in "sjoringScript". tl;dr explanation in spoiler tag.
The issue is that the script in the original plugin awarded +2 reputation when you kill Sjoring, as long as you're at least guardian rank in the FG. This was intended to be awarded for completing Sjoring's "Kill the Master Thief" quest to kill Jim Stacey.
But it would also be awarded if you kill Sjoring as part of Percius' "Kill Hard-Heart" quest (you have to be guardian rank to receive that quest in the first place). So killing Sjoring for Percius would award you +2 immediately upon killing him, then +3 upon reporting to Percius, for +5 total (and then potentially another +2 from Jim Stacey, for +7 total).
There were a few potential solutions that turned out to be inadequate due to this being way too complicated.
My eventual solution was to use a global variable to ensure that only one of these sources of reputation (the script on Sjoring, and Percius' dialogue) can be earned. But this led to another problem. If you're on Percius's quest to kill Sjoring, you'll get the +2 from the script when killing him, which means you'll be out an intended 1 point because you'll get nothing from Percius. And we can't remove the +3 from Percius' dialogue because the player might kill Sjoring before reaching guardian rank, then rank up, get the quest from Percius, and get no rep at all.
So, I also changed the script's award to +3 instead of +2, so you'll always get +3 whether you're on the quest from Percius or Sjoring. I also removed the +1 from completing Sjoring's "Remove the Heads of the Thieves Guild" quest, so you won't earn +4 from that route. Basically Sjoring's two quests are chained together like Percius' two quests are, which is also more consistent.
This way you'll always earn +3 (no more and no less) upon killing Sjoring for an FG quest. And you can still get the +2 from Stacey as well if you're in the Thieves' Guild.
This is a super complicated case, and I haven't actually tested this in-game, so I might be missing something. If I messed something up here please let me know.
Oof, yea I had a feeling there would be some way to cheese some more reputation from the Sjoring quests. This seems like a solid solution to me, at the very least less obviously cheese-able. I'll reupload with your new file (with credit to you of course).
Also your mods are good. I use a lot of them.