I will say, this mod has a lot of potential to be a very good rebalance of the vanilla weapons, just from what I could see of the numbers and how they line up. .50 isn't a god-mode gun like it becomes in "Weapon Balance Overhaul", and pipe guns retain a long-term use. Now the bad from what I could see from the short time I messed with it:
Gauss Rifle base damage is FAR to high. 500 base(from what I was seeing on a toon experimenting with the weapon mods) means that it's a god-weapon even without rifle skills. Upgraded I was seeing the weapon reach 900+ damage(and without rifleman), easily, from the math. I would lower that to 250 base if your trying to balance it on one shot per reload, or even 200. To be honest I didn't mind the balance philosophy of WBO: 3-10 shots 200 base perhaps? Remember that you upgraded .50 to a usable caliber in the long-run as an alternative for heavy anti armor.
But I like how, again from what I could see:
Regular Pipe guns remain combat viable with the upgraded frames, .45 and receivers. Seeing pipe guns compete with combat rifles/assault rifles to me is a god send. .50 is powerful but not to powerful. More than one gun can use .50 with upgrades. Gun Nut becomes far more useful.
Some dislikes: Combat rifle has no .45 receiver, both it, and hunting rifle seem to use 5.56 receiver by default? It seemed strange, it may be from just loading my character and checking what the modifications was. But 5.56 is very, very rare until level 30+ in the regular game(rarer than .308 even), kind of makes both guns useless until 25, especially in the face of pipe guns. With .308 locked at gun nut 3, kind of makes me question the presence of them in a sense if I were to actually play this with a level 1 char and levle to say....40.
I'll mess with this more in a few days from now as I am waiting for some things to arrive. So far, the numbers are where I agree with, except the gauss(and again, thats because it's a mother of god weapon with 500 base even if it is one shot/reload).
The plasma is just as bad currently :O But yes I am tweaking around on this still. Just haven´t felt that motivated to play fallout 4 in recent days.
The reasoning why there is no .45 receiver for the combat rifle is rather simple honestly. The .45 is a pistol caliber and has nothing to do with a combat rifle, who actually should be chambered, given the name, in 308 or something.
I think fixing plasma and the gauss, as well as DLC support(something not a single weapon balance mod has right now, even weapon balance overhaul has neglected nuka world) would immensly help this mod. Especially the DLC support, actually, since there isn't a single weapon balance mod yet that actually accomidates DLC's. Kind of sucks that I cannot use the ak-47 introduced in nuka world with mods like this, especially since that weapon also has terrible "Awesome but impractical!" drawbacks of extremely high and unusual perk requirements for it to be useful(I mean, rifleman 5 or commando 5 to max the weapon out and combat rifles get the same results earlier and limited ammo supply? no thanks).
This mod getting dlc support for the dlc's would probably cause it to get lots of endorsments and downloads for those wanting to use something other than gauss and plasma rifles(which yes, should adjust them ).
Many guns do a bit to much damage to early, but so far that only seems to make the early game easier or quicker, rather than imbalancing the entire game. I tested with a low int character who took gun-nut and used stealth, here are my findings:
Overall, .50 shows up very frequently as a chambered gun to early in leveled lists and in the hands of near anyone, which can be a problem quickly making the mod a "play stealth or else!" mod, somewhat similar to arbitration or weapon balance overhaul.
Likewise upgraded weapons see immense damage over unupgraded weapons, which I thought was fine, but it felt as if I could get far to high a damage far to quickly, a more gradual improvement in equipment quality may be a smart adjustment. At the same time, some upgrades arrive at "End game" and make those weapons unviable, especially the laser rifle, and the focused lense requiring rank 4 science(I think it should only need 3, or we should have other lenses which only take science ranks 1-3.)
I've seen very good use of .38 pipe guns, and .48 served it's purpose, but I found at times bolts and lens modifications for hunting rifles and laser rifles(both regular and institute) to be far to impractical to craft, I had to find a .50 hunting rifle, and mod it into a .308 by replacing a .308 rifle's chambering with a 5.56, and then move the .308 chambering mod to a .50 to get a real .308 rifle with a real bolt, because even a standarb bolt takes Gun-Nut 4. The same problem can be seen with lenses for laser rifles, I thought it was silly. Heck .50's in general were way to common early on as a rifle.
Overall, the idea is there, you just need to smooth the numbers and upgrades out. Fallout 4 generally is a game where the original design was "Pipe guns at 1-10, combat rifles/laser rifles at 11-25, gauss rifles only at 35+", which to me was a bother, and it seems to me though that you seem to have an aim for bullet balance like follows:
Light Calibers: .38 and 5mm Medium Calibers: Fusion cells, 5.56, .45 ect Heavy Calibers: Plasma Carts, .50, 2mm cc ect.
Again, i'd smooth the upgrades out, make sure there are upgrades for all categories available at levels before the 40s(since some upgrades have that dreaded "This arrives way to late hurr hurr hur, so it's useless!" problem). A pipe gun getting to say, 35 damage in the mid-10s would be acceptable if we can assume it'd shoot up to 50s in the 20s ect. Again, it just boils down to smoothing them out.
It´s mostly a thing of having to make copies though. I can add requirements on a mod by mod basis and as long as mods don´t have graphical components can I use one mod for all guns. Which reduces worktime by 99%.
Making unique mods for every gun would make it far more daunting to maintain and create in the first place.
And the standard bolt taking gun nut four is a bug.
I've been using this mod for a while now and I've grown to love it, as it does a great job at balancing weapon damage across the board to make the game pretty interesting. Paired up with Better Locational Damage, it's quite an adventure!
I have to ask though, is it normal for the combat knife to be weaker than the switchblade, or is there another mod that's messing that up? Switchblade is 19 damage while combat knife is 13, last I checked.
Hey man great mod! Just wondering, how much of a difference does this mod make on the new survival mode? (Does it work at all?) Just started a new account the damage seems way better but at one point I shot a raider in the head 3 times before he was out. Of course I was using a 5.56 so if I upgraded too a bigger caliber would it be stronger? I'd like to 1 hit people because I'm sorry a piece of lead going through your brain is gonna kill you no matter how big. Lol again great mod!
First, what level are you? Enemies get more health the higher your level is... don´t question why, its how bethesda games work.
Secondly you could try to download my complete reballance, I uploaded it, it should remove some of the level scaling, making hp for low level enemies higher and for high level lower.
This mod does not touch the damage multipliers, which are 0,5 dealt and 1 or 2 takes in survivial if I remember right.
I've been using Weapon Balance Overhaul on it's own for some time now.
Recently I've been looking into using this mod instead, along with Better Locational Damage.
WBO has clearly laid out the balance philosophy on its description page, with the idea that weapons should be characterized by ranges, damage, and mag size.
Your description, does not really go into detail about your thought process, and balancing the weapons relative to one another beyond that similar caliburs will have similar damage. For example, what are the main differences between a Combat Rifle and an Assault Rifle in your mod? Are Flamethrowers useful? How about the Double Barrel Shotgun vs the Combat Shotgun? Pipe Weapons vs others?
It'd be much nicer to hear you philosophy on weapon usage, rather than digging through the esp files myself.
EDIT: Disregard the part about the Flamer and Shotguns. I didn't see the WIP part at the bottom. Would still be nice to hear your thoughts about those weapons even though you don't have changes currently.
Well simple actually. Damage is based on Calliber. I have a sheet of numbers where each ammo type gives has a certain damage value. The weapon type does mostly only affect rate of fire, range, accuracy and magazine size. So a Combat Rifle and a Assault rifle, having the same mods installed, have identical per shot damage. The assault rifle is less accurate for having a lot more fire rate.
Flamers are beast in the not yet released version. They Melt through almost anything.
Double barreld shotgun and combat shotgun will have the same damage, once I get around to it. Only difference being that the combat Shotgun has a magazine.
Gauss Rifles are the best ballistic weapon, but with massive recoil and tiny magazine size.
u should change nmms version number when updating. not only do people then see if and when u update but also dont get a message that their version is out of date when they updated because its not version 0.8 (which is the version u set to be the most updated one atm)
Hi! This mod is really neat! All the additional weapon customization is very welcome indeed!
However something might be off with Plasma weaponry: my maxed out plasma sniper now does over 1,200 damage? ( and that's before sneak multipliers. I kind just one shot a behemoth )
Well a maxed out Gauss rifle does currently 2000 damage, I might lower theese values in the future/ make it more difficult to get your hands on the high tier mods.
Did you download my other rebalance mods? Just curious, else i might have to change a few things about that one too.
Having trouble doing the whole .50 receiver on my hunting rifle, it has no required items or perks listed. thus I'm unable to upgrade my rifle. I might have done something wrong.
Looks like something I might take a look at later. For know I plan to get the vanilla weapons done and support for some modded ones first. Don´t have that much time for modding currently
Ps. I think this mod here alone did already eat more than 20 hours of my life.....
Still I think I could add different ammo types at a later date. I just have to finish the other weapons first.
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Gauss Rifle base damage is FAR to high. 500 base(from what I was seeing on a toon experimenting with the weapon mods) means that it's a god-weapon even without rifle skills. Upgraded I was seeing the weapon reach 900+ damage(and without rifleman), easily, from the math. I would lower that to 250 base if your trying to balance it on one shot per reload, or even 200. To be honest I didn't mind the balance philosophy of WBO: 3-10 shots 200 base perhaps? Remember that you upgraded .50 to a usable caliber in the long-run as an alternative for heavy anti armor.
But I like how, again from what I could see:
Regular Pipe guns remain combat viable with the upgraded frames, .45 and receivers. Seeing pipe guns compete with combat rifles/assault rifles to me is a god send.
.50 is powerful but not to powerful.
More than one gun can use .50 with upgrades.
Gun Nut becomes far more useful.
Some dislikes:
Combat rifle has no .45 receiver, both it, and hunting rifle seem to use 5.56 receiver by default? It seemed strange, it may be from just loading my character and checking what the modifications was. But 5.56 is very, very rare until level 30+ in the regular game(rarer than .308 even), kind of makes both guns useless until 25, especially in the face of pipe guns. With .308 locked at gun nut 3, kind of makes me question the presence of them in a sense if I were to actually play this with a level 1 char and levle to say....40.
I'll mess with this more in a few days from now as I am waiting for some things to arrive. So far, the numbers are where I agree with, except the gauss(and again, thats because it's a mother of god weapon with 500 base even if it is one shot/reload).
The reasoning why there is no .45 receiver for the combat rifle is rather simple honestly. The .45 is a pistol caliber and has nothing to do with a combat rifle, who actually should be chambered, given the name, in 308 or something.
This mod getting dlc support for the dlc's would probably cause it to get lots of endorsments and downloads for those wanting to use something other than gauss and plasma rifles(which yes, should adjust them
Many guns do a bit to much damage to early, but so far that only seems to make the early game easier or quicker, rather than imbalancing the entire game. I tested with a low int character who took gun-nut and used stealth, here are my findings:
Overall, .50 shows up very frequently as a chambered gun to early in leveled lists and in the hands of near anyone, which can be a problem quickly making the mod a "play stealth or else!" mod, somewhat similar to arbitration or weapon balance overhaul.
Likewise upgraded weapons see immense damage over unupgraded weapons, which I thought was fine, but it felt as if I could get far to high a damage far to quickly, a more gradual improvement in equipment quality may be a smart adjustment. At the same time, some upgrades arrive at "End game" and make those weapons unviable, especially the laser rifle, and the focused lense requiring rank 4 science(I think it should only need 3, or we should have other lenses which only take science ranks 1-3.)
I've seen very good use of .38 pipe guns, and .48 served it's purpose, but I found at times bolts and lens modifications for hunting rifles and laser rifles(both regular and institute) to be far to impractical to craft, I had to find a .50 hunting rifle, and mod it into a .308 by replacing a .308 rifle's chambering with a 5.56, and then move the .308 chambering mod to a .50 to get a real .308 rifle with a real bolt, because even a standarb bolt takes Gun-Nut 4. The same problem can be seen with lenses for laser rifles, I thought it was silly. Heck .50's in general were way to common early on as a rifle.
Overall, the idea is there, you just need to smooth the numbers and upgrades out. Fallout 4 generally is a game where the original design was "Pipe guns at 1-10, combat rifles/laser rifles at 11-25, gauss rifles only at 35+", which to me was a bother, and it seems to me though that you seem to have an aim for bullet balance like follows:
Light Calibers: .38 and 5mm
Medium Calibers: Fusion cells, 5.56, .45 ect
Heavy Calibers: Plasma Carts, .50, 2mm cc ect.
Again, i'd smooth the upgrades out, make sure there are upgrades for all categories available at levels before the 40s(since some upgrades have that dreaded "This arrives way to late hurr hurr hur, so it's useless!" problem). A pipe gun getting to say, 35 damage in the mid-10s would be acceptable if we can assume it'd shoot up to 50s in the 20s ect. Again, it just boils down to smoothing them out.
Making unique mods for every gun would make it far more daunting to maintain and create in the first place.
And the standard bolt taking gun nut four is a bug.
I have to ask though, is it normal for the combat knife to be weaker than the switchblade, or is there another mod that's messing that up? Switchblade is 19 damage while combat knife is 13, last I checked.
Secondly you could try to download my complete reballance, I uploaded it, it should remove some of the level scaling, making hp for low level enemies higher and for high level lower.
This mod does not touch the damage multipliers, which are 0,5 dealt and 1 or 2 takes in survivial if I remember right.
Recently I've been looking into using this mod instead, along with Better Locational Damage.
WBO has clearly laid out the balance philosophy on its description page, with the idea that weapons should be characterized by ranges, damage, and mag size.
Your description, does not really go into detail about your thought process, and balancing the weapons relative to one another beyond that similar caliburs will have similar damage. For example, what are the main differences between a Combat Rifle and an Assault Rifle in your mod? Are Flamethrowers useful? How about the Double Barrel Shotgun vs the Combat Shotgun? Pipe Weapons vs others?
It'd be much nicer to hear you philosophy on weapon usage, rather than digging through the esp files myself.
EDIT: Disregard the part about the Flamer and Shotguns. I didn't see the WIP part at the bottom. Would still be nice to hear your thoughts about those weapons even though you don't have changes currently.
The weapon type does mostly only affect rate of fire, range, accuracy and magazine size.
So a Combat Rifle and a Assault rifle, having the same mods installed, have identical per shot damage. The assault rifle is less accurate for having a lot more fire rate.
Flamers are beast in the not yet released version. They Melt through almost anything.
Double barreld shotgun and combat shotgun will have the same damage, once I get around to it. Only difference being that the combat Shotgun has a magazine.
Gauss Rifles are the best ballistic weapon, but with massive recoil and tiny magazine size.
Plasma is king.
(Thanks for notifying me though, if i don´t update that one it´s mostly because i simply forget)
However something might be off with Plasma weaponry: my maxed out plasma sniper now does over 1,200 damage? ( and that's before sneak multipliers. I kind just one shot a behemoth
Did you download my other rebalance mods? Just curious, else i might have to change a few things about that one too.
The Receiver mod does still excist in the game files, but it is 100% obsolete and should only exsist on guns that you had before installing the mod.
I recomend using this mod with a new Version of the game, but it works on existing games to.
http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/9057/?
It adds an ammo swapping system not unlike New Vegas' interpretation, and it is from the creator of the DT resource.
Ps. I think this mod here alone did already eat more than 20 hours of my life.....
Still I think I could add different ammo types at a later date. I just have to finish the other weapons first.
I plan to redo all weapons, including the ones added by mods.
http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/8807/?