There's a vanilla quest that may have a conflict with SS2 Ch3 and Depravity.
Spoiler:
Show
One of the possible faction allies in Ch3 is Diamond City. The requirement to get them as a faction is to have completed "In Sheep's Clothing", which is the original quest to confront Mayor McDonough as a synth and watch Piper blast him. That quest starts once you've been kicked out of the Institute, regardless if you did the quest to get a report from him or not.
But with Depravity mod, I don't think "In Sheep's Clothing" is ever flagged as completed, even after you finish "The System Has Failed" and either killed McDonough or taken him prisoner.
In fact, if my memory is correct, the last time I played through the Thuggy mods I was able to complete "The System Has Failed" before even going into the Institute. Because I kept McDonough as a prisoner, I was still able to get the Institute quest "Political Leanings". I just had to go talk to McDonough in his prison cell in DC Security instead of finding him in his office. But it worked just fine.
And if "In Sheep's Clothing" hasn't been flagged as completed, you'll never be able to get DC (and The Ron) as an ally in Ch3.
Instead of trying to force-complete "In Sheep's Clothing", which could potentially cause some conflicts with the Depravity mod, maybe there's an easier/better way to adjust the SS2 Ch3 ally recruitment requirements? Adjust it so that getting DC (The Ron) as an ally, you still need to complete all NLTC quests, but instead of requiring "In Sheep's Clothing" to be completed it requires "The System Has Failed" to be completed.
So yeah, adding so it checks for either "In Sheep's Clothing" or "The System Has Failed" sounds like a valid solution. Will look into that. Downside here is that I do not want to cause issues and touch the original quests.
Ohh got an idea. Might be solution. Hopefully kinggath will work with me here!
I read your reply in the PV - SS2 patch topic, and that would be a great fix if they're willing to work with you on it. If not, your patches might require an alternative like touching the Ch3 mod to change ally requirements.
I love the Thuggy mods, they allow players to progress through the main storyline in a way that mostly "makes more sense" for end-game outcome. While I don't agree with some of their quests, that's ok because there are options to skip/cancel those quests. But playing as the "good guy", both OaR and PV give the ending I prefer. And Depravity allows us to choose how we get there, potentially skipping some annoying stuff or even doing it differently.
SS2 Ch1 didn't really have any conflicts with the Thuggy mods. There might have been a couple door hijacks in some spots, but the SS2 holotape had the hijack option so that was fine. Ch2 really messed up the compatibility between the mods though, especially with Depravity. The Fallon's door hijack wasn't an issue, because the SS2 door wasn't a POI. If I needed to get into the Thuggy Fallon's, I had a FT marker that brought me directly inside. If I needed to access the SS2 Fallon's, I just went to Concord and entered their cell through the door. But Depravity's alterations to GNN had the 100% conflict with Ch2's use of the same building, and you were stuck not being able to complete the final DC quests for Depravity because of it. Thankfully, your mod fixes that conflict, and now we can enjoy both mods.
Now with SS2 Ch3, a ton more conflicts have popped up. Their door hijack system has been greatly improved, no longer requiring you to use the holotape or MCM, because every door that SS2 hijacks has the little intercom next to it which quickly and easily lets you swap which cell the door leads to. Your mods also move some doors around to make things even easier, typically when SS2 adds a door that wasn't there in vanilla instead of "hijacking" an existing door (which is where those conflicts come from, since those doors don't have the hijack intercom).
Unfortunately, Ch3 also has those conflicts mentioned due to how Ch3's end-game recruits the various main factions. As of now, without those fixes, SS2 and Thuggy mods are still mostly working with your patches, but eventually you'll be unable to recruit ANY of the main factions in Ch3. It's just not possible with their current faction requirements.
I'm really hoping that the staff over at SS2 are willing to make the tweaks needed. Not just for the Thuggy mods, but easier compatibility between any other mods out there that could be causing conflicts due to those recruitment requirements. For now, I'm just going to take my sweet time to slowly move through as much as I can before I get close to the Ch3 end-game content again. Hopefully by then, the SS2 team will have patched in a compatibility option, or you've gone around it some other way.
Gonna give it a little time for them to get back on me reaching out and then decide what to do after that based on how that goes :)
Edit: Good news is that it seems to already be built in a way that would let me patch this without actually having to touch any of the quests directly. They essentially have a check that starts "QuestX" when you meet the condition for that Faction, and when the time is right it'll grab dialogues from that quest. So all one gotta do is start that quest in a patch by the alternative method, and good to go!
That's pretty nice, should make it easier to add compatibility with various mods. I'm not sure how long it will be before the SS2 team responds, considering Ch3 is "finished" and the main work on SS2 is bug fixes. And with Starfield having been recently released, I have a feeling a lot of people are going to be taking some time away from FO4 for a bit.
Fortunately, most of the SS2 Ch3 content that involves faction alliance options and has conflicts with mods such as Thuggyverse, that's all towards the end of Ch3. I'm not sure what difference it would make to the final outcome, in the event players don't recruit at least one of those main factions, but I'm sure SS2 wouldn't have made it impossible. So for now, even without a compatibility patch, playing Thuggy's stuff first and then finishing SS2 just means you won't get the Ch3 ending you "want", but it shouldn't totally ruin your game.
I'm currently doing "Under One Banner" in Ch3 again, and can confirm that the conflict between Depravity and SS2 Ch3 is there. I have completed all of the Depravity main content, meaning I took control of Diamond City. I've also finished all of the SS2 side quests that involve The Ron. The only missing requirement from SS2's end is "In Sheep's Clothing" being complete, which technically was "bypassed" during Depravity mod by using an alternative version of that storyline.
And because the vanilla quest was never flagged as complete, it's currently impossible to get The Ron (and DC) as an ally. As you mention, the "simplest" fix is to change the Ch3 ally requirements or set up a different trigger that can bypass those requirements. Without the fix, DC as an ally is impossible to obtain.
In regards to the Depravity features after taking DC, I just thought of something that may or may not be causing my game's conflict.
During the final DC quest, when you choose what to do with the various guilty parties, I choose to have all of them locked up. The mayor is tossed in jail to await execution while the others are put on public display. But I typically don't have the mayor executed until the end of my game, because I'm always wondering if there was another quest somewhere that would point me to speak with him.
This time around, I did the same thing as I usually do, let the mayor rot in jail. But that got me thinking, is it possible that because the mayor is still alive, maybe it's not fully triggering something to cause "In Sheep's Clothing" to be fully flagged as done? I mean, elsewhere in the game people talk as if that quest had been finished, but maybe not killing the mayor yet was holding up something in the background.
I just went in and ordered the mayor executed, and then shot him in the head myself just to make sure. I haven't seen any messages yet to meet The Ron as an envoy, so I don't know if that worked or not. But it's something that I'll keep an eye on, just in case that was holding up the ally requirement for DC in Ch3.
I don't think there is any triggers set in place to finish up the Sheep quest as far as I can tell.
I was considering adding some, but due to how the Depravity quest mess with the npcs involved, after you're done the Depravity quest it's no longer possible to even start the Sheep quest anymore, so it would need to been done during the specific depravity quest.
Still possible I start modifying the Depravity quest, but rather wanna avoid that.
The SS2 Wiki states the requirement for getting Diamond City (The Ron) as an ally for Chapter 3 is to have completed all of the NLTC questline, and also have compeleted "In Sheep's Clothing". The ISC requirement is because the previous mayor needs to be gone in order for that dialogue of The Ron taking over in that role.
If there's no actual "trigger" or "toggle" to check if "In Sheep's Clothing" was completed, maybe the requirement is looking for something else? Could it be that it's checking to see if the mayor is dead but DC is not hostile? Because as far as I know, completing ISC is the only way to kill the mayor without DC turning hostile.
Depravity does alter the ISC questline by basically skipping it and adding in their own version. The new version doesn't involve Piper, Danny, etc. The mayor still does some of his original dialogue, but in the end he's put in jail (or killed if you go that route). If you choose to lock him up, his only option later is to schedule for execution. Unless the player delays the execution (like me), the end results of the Depravity version should be almost identical to the original ISC. All vanilla characters and companions will have the same dialogue pop up as if ISC was finished, etc.
I'm still a day or so out from finishing Ch3 again, but once I do I'll let you know if The Ron (DC) comes up as an ally later, since I've made sure McDonough is dead now. If Ron shows up, then no patch for him needed. Just need to make sure the player completes all of the Depravity DC quests and either kills or executes McDonough prior to starting Ch3. If Ron doesn't show up even after that, then need to find out exactly what Ch3 is looking for as a flag to get DC as an ally. They say it's completion of ISC, but maybe it's something else that's closely related.
UPDATE: So, after finishing Ch3 again, I can confirm that The Ron never did show up as an ally. So there must be something with ISC that is flagging him as an ally, since that's the only thing different this playthrough regarding DC. Mayor McDonough is dead, and the general dialogue I hear is the same as if ISC was done. So it's got to be something else with that quest, not just the mayor being dead.
Might have a solution to get Diamond City and The Ron as an ally in Ch3. You can manually start the HQ envoy scene, so it would be possible to set up a check and run the command. I think this is how you did the RR/Inst fix in the PV patch?
So if you're able to have a check to make sure the other requirements are met (all NLTC quests, and finished the Depravity DC quests), and then fire off the command when needed.
This is the only Thuggyverse/SS2 Patch that crashes my game on startup. I'm not sure, but I think it may have something to do with some of the form IDs are below 800 and that tends to conflict with FO4VR. When I poke around in xEdit, I'm seeing things like bobby pins being overridden with a blank records from this patch. I've been told in the past for VR to just renumber the form ID's if any are below 800 and that seems to work for a lot of mods, but that doesn't seem to be working on this patch as I'm still seeing records below 800. (I'm no expert, but I do like to poke around and break things :) Any chance for some assistance?
When I approach Gunner's Plaza, the buried nuke mines still kill me. Is there a work around so I can finish Depravity first? Do we know what SS2 quest the nuke mines appear? I got the prototype gauss rifle earlier on and there were no mines. My only workaround to date is changing to 'very hard' and toggling 'god mode' to clear the mine field. I enjoy survival mode, but TGM has been disabled in console commands.
There really isn't a workaround in place for that atm. If you progress SS2 far enough you're out of a choice and will have to do the SS2 Path of clearing it out.
Patch does account for this though, so you'll be able to finish the quest just fine.
Just want to ask, any chance of stuff like this being done for other mods from these folk? Or are they already non-conflicting? The reason for asking mainly being that I like having a ton of story mods - but don't want to have anything to do with the full Storywealth collection since I don't like a lot of the *completely* NSFW stuff.
For starters, I think you're overestimating how "NSFW" A StoryWealth is. Depravity is probably the worst you'll find forced upon you. Any CBBE "Skimpy" mods are optional content.
For some reasons the second door never appears for me I have all dependencies but its not there? I use vortex so it occurs to me it might be a load-order thing but I wanted to ask here before I started messing with things again.
I am having the same problem however if there isn't a response to it soon or you haven found this info yet sim settlements 2 has a holotape it gives you for city planning and whatnot and it also has a hijack function allowing you to turn doors on or off to areas that is affected by the mod incase of a mod conflict allowing you to play both
So this patch doesn't remove or add a door, it moves the original door. So if it doesn't appear that means the original trigger to enable the door isn't being triggered. Which is outside what this mod touches.
Wondering: Which particular other StoryWealth patches for the thuggyverse are usable w/o having to run StoryWealth? I always assumed the patches had some special tweaking that was tailored exclusively for StoryWealth, so being able to use 'em to wrestle my own idiosyncratic load order into submission is welcome.
In general the "StoryWealth" patches outside for some more generic ones like Weapons, Armors, Sorter and so on are essentially made to work as long as you got the mods listed in the requirements.
We're making them this way to make sure that they benefit the most amount of users.
Sweet, and thanks [yet] again. I already use your exofied Depravity - Fallons patch & just recently grabbed the Proj Valk - SS2 patch... didn't know about the OaR patch, so thanks!, but *sad trombone fx* I don't use Fast Ravel From Quest Hubs (at least, for now), so can't use.
And reallyappreciate the making sure they benefit the most amount of users thing.
As I can't find the page for Depravity, I'll leave my comments here. This mod is, in a word, terrible. The Sole Survivor, fresh out of the vault, gets kidnapped by slavers in Concord. After making his way to the top floor of this makeshift prison, he confronts his captors - one of which is a ghoul. And he has no reaction at all; he isn't even upset about being kidnapped. It totally disrupted my role-playing experience and I promptly uninstalled it, knowing full well that it could potentially mess up other parts of the "A StoryWealth" collection. Up until that unfortunate encounter in Concord, I was fully enjoying the collection.
Wait til ya have to learn how to die 50 ways at Dr. Nick's. Or journey to the Sun. You did see the word/mod title Depravity, yes?
Also: The Sole Survivor, fresh out of the vault and franticly searching for his/her son in a post-apocalyptic hellscape, AND freshly warned by Codsworth that the folks in Concord are *ahem* not quite as well put together [that is: unscrupulous, dangerous dicks], *might* not buy that innocent child act by Stella quite so quickly.
"This feels like a scam, kid, and I don't care about your friend that you don't *really* seem all that afraid for... ... Somebody just shot my spouse and stole my baby, so unless you can give me something I can use to fix THAT, then your friend Murphy can suck a fat one for a while, got it?!?"
And maybe not immediately break into spooky abandoned department store administration buildings that are obvious raider slave traps.
Instead, he/she *might* choose to proceed to the Museum of Freedom, as God and Todd intended, and maybe only circle back to deal with the juvenile con artist sometime after Kellogg is kaput (and the Survivor's son's whereabouts discovered). 'Mershun preserved.
I can't seem to get this patch to work regarding the Gunner Plaza. I'm in the beginning of SS2 Chapter 2 where Gunners start regularly attacking random settlements (way before you and Jake stage the attack on Gunner Plaza). I have this patch loaded after SS2 and Depravity. I get to Gunners Plaza, TGM my way through the nuke minefield, and I see that every door to Gunner Plaza is [Inaccessible]. The quest marker for "We the People" takes me to the elevator on the top of Gunner Plaza which does not work. Any solutions to this?
I am having a issue with Dylan the patch seems to work but when Dylan moves into concord he tends to just walk up to his door and stands there don't even enter the building at all. Is there a fix for this?
93 comments
which is the original quest to confront Mayor McDonough as a synth and watch Piper blast him. That quest starts once you've been kicked out of the Institute, regardless if you did the quest to get a report from him or not.
But with Depravity mod, I don't think "In Sheep's Clothing" is ever flagged as completed, even after you finish "The System Has Failed" and either killed McDonough or taken him prisoner.
In fact, if my memory is correct, the last time I played through the Thuggy mods I was able to complete "The System Has Failed" before even going into the Institute. Because I kept McDonough as a prisoner, I was still able to get the Institute quest "Political Leanings". I just had to go talk to McDonough in his prison cell in DC Security instead of finding him in his office. But it worked just fine.
And if "In Sheep's Clothing" hasn't been flagged as completed, you'll never be able to get DC (and The Ron) as an ally in Ch3.
Instead of trying to force-complete "In Sheep's Clothing", which could potentially cause some conflicts with the Depravity mod, maybe there's an easier/better way to adjust the SS2 Ch3 ally recruitment requirements? Adjust it so that getting DC (The Ron) as an ally, you still need to complete all NLTC quests, but instead of requiring "In Sheep's Clothing" to be completed it requires "The System Has Failed" to be completed.
Downside here is that I do not want to cause issues and touch the original quests.
Ohh got an idea. Might be solution. Hopefully kinggath will work with me here!
I love the Thuggy mods, they allow players to progress through the main storyline in a way that mostly "makes more sense" for end-game outcome. While I don't agree with some of their quests, that's ok because there are options to skip/cancel those quests. But playing as the "good guy", both OaR and PV give the ending I prefer. And Depravity allows us to choose how we get there, potentially skipping some annoying stuff or even doing it differently.
SS2 Ch1 didn't really have any conflicts with the Thuggy mods. There might have been a couple door hijacks in some spots, but the SS2 holotape had the hijack option so that was fine. Ch2 really messed up the compatibility between the mods though, especially with Depravity. The Fallon's door hijack wasn't an issue, because the SS2 door wasn't a POI. If I needed to get into the Thuggy Fallon's, I had a FT marker that brought me directly inside. If I needed to access the SS2 Fallon's, I just went to Concord and entered their cell through the door. But Depravity's alterations to GNN had the 100% conflict with Ch2's use of the same building, and you were stuck not being able to complete the final DC quests for Depravity because of it. Thankfully, your mod fixes that conflict, and now we can enjoy both mods.
Now with SS2 Ch3, a ton more conflicts have popped up. Their door hijack system has been greatly improved, no longer requiring you to use the holotape or MCM, because every door that SS2 hijacks has the little intercom next to it which quickly and easily lets you swap which cell the door leads to. Your mods also move some doors around to make things even easier, typically when SS2 adds a door that wasn't there in vanilla instead of "hijacking" an existing door (which is where those conflicts come from, since those doors don't have the hijack intercom).
Unfortunately, Ch3 also has those conflicts mentioned due to how Ch3's end-game recruits the various main factions. As of now, without those fixes, SS2 and Thuggy mods are still mostly working with your patches, but eventually you'll be unable to recruit ANY of the main factions in Ch3. It's just not possible with their current faction requirements.
I'm really hoping that the staff over at SS2 are willing to make the tweaks needed. Not just for the Thuggy mods, but easier compatibility between any other mods out there that could be causing conflicts due to those recruitment requirements. For now, I'm just going to take my sweet time to slowly move through as much as I can before I get close to the Ch3 end-game content again. Hopefully by then, the SS2 team will have patched in a compatibility option, or you've gone around it some other way.
Edit: Good news is that it seems to already be built in a way that would let me patch this without actually having to touch any of the quests directly. They essentially have a check that starts "QuestX" when you meet the condition for that Faction, and when the time is right it'll grab dialogues from that quest. So all one gotta do is start that quest in a patch by the alternative method, and good to go!
Fortunately, most of the SS2 Ch3 content that involves faction alliance options and has conflicts with mods such as Thuggyverse, that's all towards the end of Ch3. I'm not sure what difference it would make to the final outcome, in the event players don't recruit at least one of those main factions, but I'm sure SS2 wouldn't have made it impossible. So for now, even without a compatibility patch, playing Thuggy's stuff first and then finishing SS2 just means you won't get the Ch3 ending you "want", but it shouldn't totally ruin your game.
And because the vanilla quest was never flagged as complete, it's currently impossible to get The Ron (and DC) as an ally. As you mention, the "simplest" fix is to change the Ch3 ally requirements or set up a different trigger that can bypass those requirements. Without the fix, DC as an ally is impossible to obtain.
Will look into it more, but think I'll have to cycle back to it at a later time though.
During the final DC quest, when you choose what to do with the various guilty parties, I choose to have all of them locked up. The mayor is tossed in jail to await execution while the others are put on public display. But I typically don't have the mayor executed until the end of my game, because I'm always wondering if there was another quest somewhere that would point me to speak with him.
This time around, I did the same thing as I usually do, let the mayor rot in jail. But that got me thinking, is it possible that because the mayor is still alive, maybe it's not fully triggering something to cause "In Sheep's Clothing" to be fully flagged as done? I mean, elsewhere in the game people talk as if that quest had been finished, but maybe not killing the mayor yet was holding up something in the background.
I just went in and ordered the mayor executed, and then shot him in the head myself just to make sure. I haven't seen any messages yet to meet The Ron as an envoy, so I don't know if that worked or not. But it's something that I'll keep an eye on, just in case that was holding up the ally requirement for DC in Ch3.
I was considering adding some, but due to how the Depravity quest mess with the npcs involved, after you're done the Depravity quest it's no longer possible to even start the Sheep quest anymore, so it would need to been done during the specific depravity quest.
Still possible I start modifying the Depravity quest, but rather wanna avoid that.
If there's no actual "trigger" or "toggle" to check if "In Sheep's Clothing" was completed, maybe the requirement is looking for something else? Could it be that it's checking to see if the mayor is dead but DC is not hostile? Because as far as I know, completing ISC is the only way to kill the mayor without DC turning hostile.
Depravity does alter the ISC questline by basically skipping it and adding in their own version. The new version doesn't involve Piper, Danny, etc. The mayor still does some of his original dialogue, but in the end he's put in jail (or killed if you go that route). If you choose to lock him up, his only option later is to schedule for execution. Unless the player delays the execution (like me), the end results of the Depravity version should be almost identical to the original ISC. All vanilla characters and companions will have the same dialogue pop up as if ISC was finished, etc.
I'm still a day or so out from finishing Ch3 again, but once I do I'll let you know if The Ron (DC) comes up as an ally later, since I've made sure McDonough is dead now. If Ron shows up, then no patch for him needed. Just need to make sure the player completes all of the Depravity DC quests and either kills or executes McDonough prior to starting Ch3. If Ron doesn't show up even after that, then need to find out exactly what Ch3 is looking for as a flag to get DC as an ally. They say it's completion of ISC, but maybe it's something else that's closely related.
UPDATE:
So, after finishing Ch3 again, I can confirm that The Ron never did show up as an ally. So there must be something with ISC that is flagging him as an ally, since that's the only thing different this playthrough regarding DC. Mayor McDonough is dead, and the general dialogue I hear is the same as if ISC was done. So it's got to be something else with that quest, not just the mayor being dead.
So if you're able to have a check to make sure the other requirements are met (all NLTC quests, and finished the Depravity DC quests), and then fire off the command when needed.
Haven't gotten around trying to fix the quest yet myself. Partly as I didn't have a save in the right conditions to test.
Do we know what SS2 quest the nuke mines appear? I got the prototype gauss rifle earlier on and there were no mines.
My only workaround to date is changing to 'very hard' and toggling 'god mode' to clear the mine field.
I enjoy survival mode, but TGM has been disabled in console commands.
Patch does account for this though, so you'll be able to finish the quest just fine.
That said, I recently made a Outcasts and Remnants - SS2 Patch as well as a Project Valkyrie - SS2 Patch. The former even got a similar treatment on a shared location as the one seen with Fallon's in this patch.
Wondering:
Which particular other StoryWealth patches for the thuggyverse are usable w/o having to run StoryWealth?
I always assumed the patches had some special tweaking that was tailored exclusively for StoryWealth, so being able to use 'em to wrestle my own idiosyncratic load order into submission is welcome.
There is also A StoryWealth - OaR Patch and Project Valkyrie - SS2 Patch.
In general the "StoryWealth" patches outside for some more generic ones like Weapons, Armors, Sorter and so on are essentially made to work as long as you got the mods listed in the requirements.
We're making them this way to make sure that they benefit the most amount of users.
I already use your exofied Depravity - Fallons patch & just recently grabbed the Proj Valk - SS2 patch... didn't know about the OaR patch, so thanks!, but *sad trombone fx* I don't use Fast Ravel From Quest Hubs (at least, for now), so can't use.
And really appreciate the making sure they benefit the most amount of users thing.
Wait til ya have to learn how to die 50 ways at Dr. Nick's. Or journey to the Sun.
You did see the word/mod title Depravity, yes?
Also:
The Sole Survivor, fresh out of the vault and franticly searching for his/her son in a post-apocalyptic hellscape, AND freshly warned by Codsworth that the folks in Concord are *ahem* not quite as well put together [that is: unscrupulous, dangerous dicks], *might* not buy that innocent child act by Stella quite so quickly.
"This feels like a scam, kid, and I don't care about your friend that you don't *really* seem all that afraid for...
... Somebody just shot my spouse and stole my baby, so unless you can give me something I can use to fix THAT, then your friend Murphy can suck a fat one for a while, got it?!?"
And maybe not immediately break into spooky abandoned department store administration buildings that are obvious raider slave traps.
Instead, he/she *might* choose to proceed to the Museum of Freedom, as God and Todd intended, and maybe only circle back to deal with the juvenile con artist sometime after Kellogg is kaput (and the Survivor's son's whereabouts discovered). 'Mershun preserved.