There's a surprising total lack of conservative lore-friendly environment mods even after all this years. Modders pretty consistently tend to be motivated by the desire to change rather than improve, to overhaul rather than refurbish, so rather predictably tend to stray too far away from the vanilla baseline. I myself ripped textures from half a dozen of the more slight greenery mods to get a game where the new greens are better balanced with the old brows/tans (would publish "my mod", if not for it just being my compilation of other people's previous work). Thus I feel I have come closer to my goal of a nature slowly recovering from the total devastation Bethesda envisioned. Lore-friendly immersion with a slightly more varied and aesthetically appealing, less depressing landscape.
The touches you showed on the photo came close in scope, if not in execution. The light touches are good, but I would not pick such bright colors as they seem too jarring in the otherwise dead landscape. I would echo the advice given; to limit a mod to either do one thing globally or to advertise the mod as an area overhaul and then limit my efforts on one general limited area. Thanks for your effort though, hopefully the less than enthused feedback does not scare you away from trying more! :)
I might've been interested in this mod, if you hadn't taken it a little too far. I can handle greening up the area, and removing the debris and leaves around Sanctuary Hills, and even inside the homes. Because those things make sense, seeing how, as you said, Codsworth had 200+ years to do his maintenance duties. Even (partially) fixing the SS's former home might be reasonable, as it was his base of operations.
But all the stuff that you ADDED, both in the vault AND the vault exit area, is certainly too much. The point of the game is that if the SS wants or needs that stuff, they will have to find it on their own, not receive it this easily early on in the game. I even have my doubts about fixing (ALL?) the roads around Sanctuary as well as any of the other homes. Where would the robot find all the required materials?
But it's not my place to criticize you. It's your first mod and a work in progress, so you're allowed some leiway. You're trying your best to do some good, and that should always be admired. Please, keep working on it, and maybe someday I *will* pick this one up. Okay?
My thoughts too. If it's a green mod make it a green mod, if its a weapon mod make it a weapon mod etc. slit it into 2 or 3 mods people won't want to use a mod that adds loads of stuff they don't want.
Thanks Carnice. As I said in the description, this was my first mod. I do plan to remove the items inside and out that I added. They were basically just my first attempt at doing anything mod-wise. I appreciate the feedback though :)
I - for one - welcome a new modder to the community At least you contribute something - unlike some other people who are busy downtalking without having anything to show for themselves. Sure - the calendar says fall when you get out of the vault. I'm supposedly in the middle of winter according to my pipboy. But I've got flowers and greenery all over from the summer mod I installed. Because I really LONG for summer right now. And because I CAN. Sure - you put in some goodies that might be considered cheat items. But it's only cheating if you pick them up. If you don't use them it's just so much extra decoration...... Nobody shows them down your throat! Sure - the world might - realistically- look very much different in RL if an actual - and real- nuclear exchange happened. Though nobody probably knows for sure. But I'm sure Radaway and RadX would come in handy if armageddon happened. Not to mention those handy stimpacks. I know I would have died from radiation shortly into Fallout 1 if not for those nifty bottles and syringes. Not to mention FO2, FO3, Tactics, New Vwegas and.....! In some ways the Fallout universe is way ahead of us in the Real World.......... But is IS an alternative universe. And even a single player game. One in which you can do whatever you want without gaining advantage on other players by using any cheat items. Sorry for rambling but........
Thanks Bernt! Like I said in the description, the items I put in are there temporarily and will be removed as I 1) get better at modding, and 2) update this mod...which I hope to have done by the end of the week.
I like the idea of this mod but i didn't like the extra gear set up for the start of the game. I also ended up with a glitch where the only part of sanctuary that was affected by this mod was the bridge and a small part of grass near the first house from the bridge. I wish this mod just stuck to greening up sanctuary and hope that the modder will accept this small amount of feedback.
Thanks for the feedback! This was my first published mod, so it is pretty rough. I've been working on my rebuilt Sanctuary mod, and haven't revisited this one, but I plan to in the next few days.
You forget it is the middle of Fall in the region Fallout 4 is set so all the trees should be leafless at this point. A clever move by Bethesda to justify their lack of work.
Even THAT doesn't justify the total lack of green plant life. Fallout's interpretation of the post-apocalypse is an obsolete one based on science-fiction works made between the 50s and early 90s. Wanna know what an actual post-apocalypse would look like? Look at the Chernobyl Exclusion Zone, or Centralia (and those are just after a few DECADES - imagine what those places will look like in two hundred years). Nature is a LOT more resilient than we gave it credit for - even if we'd expended all of our weapons, conventional and nuclear, at the height of the Cold War, the world and life on it would be just fine.
@23r0gaming Chernobyl didn't involve massive tactical warheads that could tear a mile under the earth, it was an emission of gamma radiation. Centralia's fires are confined to the coal mines, they aren't the result of massive megaton explosives that include toxic fallout and gamma radiation. Neither of those instances are appropriate comparisons to what a nuclear annihilation event would involve.
You need to account for what the nuclear warhead's payload capacity was, how "dirty" or "clean" they were, how many were deployed and which areas were struck with how many, were they sufficient to induce certain chain reactions, and what would those chain reactions entail. Acid rain, massive Richter earthquakes, fire storms, changes in the jet stream and oceanic currents, rising sea levels, blight, droughts, destruction of toxic facilities, mass EMP bursts, etc. It's fair to say that FO's presentation of a post-nuke wasteland isn't accurate, but you're ignoring all the basic details necessary and comparing what's presented to two things that are vastly different than what an actual nuclear warhead would do. The desert wasteland presented is still accurate, it's just the locations that are askew. There would be no buildings within miles of a nuclear strike, and coastlines would recede further inland.
Well, if we really want to apply logic and reason to the FO setting, FO4 couldn't take place in the Boston region because it'd be underwater. All the nukes would melt all the icecaps, and the new sea level would engulf all the eastern seaboard and coasts along the Gulf of Mexico. This would also make the locations of FO1 and 3 impossible, as that would consume DC, and LA on the west coast would similarly be drowned out. FONV likely wouldn't exist as it does, either, as Las Vegas is within major striking distance of the Long Valley Supervolcano, which would be triggered by the earthquakes induced by the bombardment of nukes around the area, which would itself annihilate anything of Vegas that'd survive the bombs.
Ignoring that fact, you also have to consider that Boston's climate would be radically different. Despite it being in Boston in autumn, Cait regularly makes a complaint about the heat, implying that Boston in autumn at this point is much warmer. The hotter climate, coupled with the devastation of vegetation, would likely turn the area into something of a desert, especially considering Nuka World's terrain, which is just further inland in Massachusetts. Then you have to consider the literal fallout from the bombs, which would saturate the soil with toxins that would kill all plant life. Any remaining plant life prior to the bombs likely couldn't stand the new climate, so they'd never regrow. It's too hot and likely in a prolonged period of drought; what rainfall the area receives now probably isn't sufficient to maintain a proper water table. The soil would require loads of effort just to grow and maintain crops, but natural plant life would need to be hardy to survive on its own. Since desert plants aren't likely to be introduced into the region, the only plant life that could grow are the new mutated species like hubflower, bloodleaf, etc., which already resemble desert vegetation.
People enjoy mocking Bethesda for what appears to be laziness, but it's all actually deliberate, folks just don't understand the basic science involved with the notion of a post-nuke wasteland to understand why it would reasonably exist as presented.
Agreed, as its not even taking into account damage caused by human infrastructure failure. I've pointed out before in other venues that you'd have a mass leeching of toxic chemicals into the ground and oceans and the failure of thousands of atomic plants across the world.
The first Fallout game pretty specifically says the world was burned to cinders. I know its not taken particularly literally, but the world is considered a Wasteland and the aesthetics are clearly toward Mad Max rather than S.T.A.L.K.E.R.
There was a great documentary series on The Discovery Channel years ago called Life After People. No, it's not about nuclear fallout, but it does speculate about what might become of Earth if humanity instantly disappeared. Nobody to maintain things like dams and power plants. What would happen long term to skyscrapers, bridges, everything metal and concrete. Basically, crap would hit the fan.
Actually, FO4 would take place in Boston. You see guys, Boston graduated as an expert in Navy seals training. As well as did the grass. You see over those volcanos did many long trips in albecurcy before they made hot shots up in harlem. They ain't scared of a little cool breeze. In fact as we speak, those ice caps are already contacting other icecaps to inform them of the jokes both Nevada and Massachusetts made. They'll be wiped from existence before the fallout could even appear. And what's more, is that the grass would totally survive, since they like the sunlight. The waters wouldn't hurt boston one bit, and anything that would've existed, would be alive before they count to ten. Those ice caps wouldn't be dead kiddo, not while everbody is capable of photosynthesis.
@madpaddy This mod is attempting to assert something based on a notion of science, so yes, it will invite people to give their input, even when it contradicts what the mod is attempting to assert.
21 comments
The touches you showed on the photo came close in scope, if not in execution. The light touches are good, but I would not pick such bright colors as they seem too jarring in the otherwise dead landscape. I would echo the advice given; to limit a mod to either do one thing globally or to advertise the mod as an area overhaul and then limit my efforts on one general limited area. Thanks for your effort though, hopefully the less than enthused feedback does not scare you away from trying more! :)
But all the stuff that you ADDED, both in the vault AND the vault exit area, is certainly too much. The point of the game is that if the SS wants or needs that stuff, they will have to find it on their own, not receive it this easily early on in the game.
I even have my doubts about fixing (ALL?) the roads around Sanctuary as well as any of the other homes. Where would the robot find all the required materials?
But it's not my place to criticize you. It's your first mod and a work in progress, so you're allowed some leiway. You're trying your best to do some good, and that should always be admired. Please, keep working on it, and maybe someday I *will* pick this one up. Okay?
Sure - the calendar says fall when you get out of the vault. I'm supposedly in the middle of winter according to my pipboy. But I've got flowers and greenery all over from the summer mod I installed. Because I really LONG for summer right now. And because I CAN.
Sure - you put in some goodies that might be considered cheat items. But it's only cheating if you pick them up. If you don't use them it's just so much extra decoration...... Nobody shows them down your throat!
Sure - the world might - realistically- look very much different in RL if an actual - and real- nuclear exchange happened. Though nobody probably knows for sure. But I'm sure Radaway and RadX would come in handy if armageddon happened. Not to mention those handy stimpacks.
I know I would have died from radiation shortly into Fallout 1 if not for those nifty bottles and syringes. Not to mention FO2, FO3, Tactics, New Vwegas and.....! In some ways the Fallout universe is way ahead of us in the Real World.......... But is IS an alternative universe. And even a single player game. One in which you can do whatever you want without gaining advantage on other players by using any cheat items. Sorry for rambling but........
Chernobyl didn't involve massive tactical warheads that could tear a mile under the earth, it was an emission of gamma radiation. Centralia's fires are confined to the coal mines, they aren't the result of massive megaton explosives that include toxic fallout and gamma radiation. Neither of those instances are appropriate comparisons to what a nuclear annihilation event would involve.
You need to account for what the nuclear warhead's payload capacity was, how "dirty" or "clean" they were, how many were deployed and which areas were struck with how many, were they sufficient to induce certain chain reactions, and what would those chain reactions entail. Acid rain, massive Richter earthquakes, fire storms, changes in the jet stream and oceanic currents, rising sea levels, blight, droughts, destruction of toxic facilities, mass EMP bursts, etc.
It's fair to say that FO's presentation of a post-nuke wasteland isn't accurate, but you're ignoring all the basic details necessary and comparing what's presented to two things that are vastly different than what an actual nuclear warhead would do. The desert wasteland presented is still accurate, it's just the locations that are askew. There would be no buildings within miles of a nuclear strike, and coastlines would recede further inland.
Ignoring that fact, you also have to consider that Boston's climate would be radically different. Despite it being in Boston in autumn, Cait regularly makes a complaint about the heat, implying that Boston in autumn at this point is much warmer. The hotter climate, coupled with the devastation of vegetation, would likely turn the area into something of a desert, especially considering Nuka World's terrain, which is just further inland in Massachusetts. Then you have to consider the literal fallout from the bombs, which would saturate the soil with toxins that would kill all plant life.
Any remaining plant life prior to the bombs likely couldn't stand the new climate, so they'd never regrow. It's too hot and likely in a prolonged period of drought; what rainfall the area receives now probably isn't sufficient to maintain a proper water table. The soil would require loads of effort just to grow and maintain crops, but natural plant life would need to be hardy to survive on its own. Since desert plants aren't likely to be introduced into the region, the only plant life that could grow are the new mutated species like hubflower, bloodleaf, etc., which already resemble desert vegetation.
People enjoy mocking Bethesda for what appears to be laziness, but it's all actually deliberate, folks just don't understand the basic science involved with the notion of a post-nuke wasteland to understand why it would reasonably exist as presented.
The first Fallout game pretty specifically says the world was burned to cinders. I know its not taken particularly literally, but the world is considered a Wasteland and the aesthetics are clearly toward Mad Max rather than S.T.A.L.K.E.R.
You see over those volcanos did many long trips in albecurcy before they made hot shots up in harlem.
They ain't scared of a little cool breeze.
In fact as we speak, those ice caps are already contacting other icecaps to inform them of the jokes both Nevada and Massachusetts made. They'll be wiped from existence before the fallout could even appear.
And what's more, is that the grass would totally survive, since they like the sunlight. The waters wouldn't hurt boston one bit, and anything that would've existed, would be alive before they count to ten.
Those ice caps wouldn't be dead kiddo, not while everbody is capable of photosynthesis.
This mod is attempting to assert something based on a notion of science, so yes, it will invite people to give their input, even when it contradicts what the mod is attempting to assert.