we wanted the OPTION to be evil,not be FORCED to be good,this DLC kinda does the opposite of that,it FORCES you to be evil or pretty much do nothing in the DLC.while yes you can kill the raider bosses right off the bat,that makes the DLC end in like 15 minutes,5 of that just getting to nuka world,another five getting through the gauntlet....unless your me and go there 700 pounds over-encumbered,in which case its like 15 minutes there and another 15 through the gauntlet.
that being said i still really enjoy the DLC,i just wish there was a raider gang that liked guns,because you've got the pack who like pure strength,the disciples who like knives,and the operators who like caps and dont give a f*#@ how they got them.
I agree, people can't be happy no matter what is given to them.
Also, there is no such thing as good and evil, it's all a matter of perspective. Raiders and Minutemen share the same goals, but have different approaches.
I ended up getting through most of the questline until the raiding part, that's where I killed them all. Ensured I got the most content out of my preferred choice. I had to do that for each of the factions in the base-game of Fallout 4 too, and for the factions in Far Harbor.
Turns out my character isn't good, he's just manipulative.
Its fun to be evil in a video game because there are no real world consequences. There is always that option to do over or go back to a previous save. Deep down, we all want to be the bad guy in video games (just look at Grand Theft Auto games), and to do things that we can't do in real life but to have it optional in the game is a bonus. Thank you for this Itksm!
People didn't necessarily want to be evil. People wanted choices that weren't somewhat related to being a concerned parent. With Bethesda, it seems that morality is black and white.
is not the fact that it forces you to be evil, is the fact that you take over your own settlements and lose preston, altho im tired of fucking go defend X Settlement, but alas, i think is stupid the game makes you to populate settlements AND THEN forces you to reeplace themwith raiders instead holy hell i kill raiders all day long to free the place for people AND THEN you make me put even bader raiders there f*#@ off bethesda
i didnt want to be good or evil, these things are not black and white like that. I.WANTED.CHOICES. like a good old rpg game. i finished fallout 4 with a meh face. played this shitty nuka world a little and refused to continue. far harbor was good tho. but after spending 150+hours in fallout 4 i realized its better to play Borderlands 2 again. its a way better version of fallout 4.
I think people wanted to be able to be evil throughout the game, not after playing as the good guy for 100 hours.
The disconnect is staggering to be honest. The whole game pushes you down the good guy route, then you arrive at Nuka World and you're expected to become a raider boss and go evil.
It's not just a case of good versus evil - it has more to do with being smart versus psychotically dumb. One of the raider leaders says she wants caps. From the worn, exhausted, impoverished settlers? Really? And why does she want caps? Is Tiffany selling a diamond necklace she wants or perhaps she dreams of sitting back on a beach in the Bahamas? There just isn't that much to spend caps on.
So the raiders want to raid the Commonwealth for slaves... for what? What are these slaves going to be doing? The slave collars certainly aren't helping the Nuka-World market draw customers. What else could these slaves do to generate wealth that contented free men and women under the gangs 'protection' could not?
One of the key aspects of evil is selfishness and yet these raiders allow their pursuit of wealth and power to be interfered with by the psychotic blood lust of their comrades. That would never happen. Anyone hurting slaves or interfering with production would earn a bullet in the head. And in spite of one leader talking about how rules are not wanted mob bosses in the real world impose more laws and codes of behavior than normal people live by.
The smart move would be to free the slaves, invest them into a system that attracts others, build up an economy and town where the gangs are the police and government until enough wealth is flowing that someone builds a beach resort in the Bahamas. What the raiders want to do, however, is just small time crazy fighting over scraps like dogs in a junkyard. A leader doesn't need to be tough; he needs to be smart and these guys are miles away from that.
RE Wolfmod: "The smart move would be to free the slaves, invest them into a system that attracts others, build up an economy and town where the gangs are the police and government until enough wealth is flowing that someone builds a beach resort in the Bahamas. "
That's pretty much how New Vegas came to be. Fallout NV had some good writing. :D
"Raiders and Minutemen share the same goals, just have different approaches"
???????? Uh...in what universe? Minutemen want to make the Commonwealth safe and band the citizens together for the common good. Raiders are completely self-serving. Unless you know something I don't.
"I agree, people can't be happy no matter what is given to them.
Also, there is no such thing as good and evil, it's all a matter of perspective. Raiders and Minutemen share the same goals, but have different approaches."
its true, there is no Human definition for "evil" humans are just driven to kill. stupid people put labels on actions that are disagreeable as evil or monstrous. its like the military vs civilians Killing each other crap, military calls it Duty, civilians call it killing. Killing is killing, its part human primordial behavior.
while yes I did just justify death by another human, I myself do not happily accept such behavior, Im merely explaining a fact.
I'm going to write here a fast guide to do the Nuka-World campaign losing only two evil quests, that you don't want to do if you are reading this guide, and the radiant quests of the raiders (that, seeing how this is about not being evil, it's not exactly a loss).
Advance through the camaign until you get the quest "The Grand Tour" (so basically, finish the gaunlet, talk with Cage and with the bosses of each raider gang). Look for Preston Garvey or Mackenzie Bridgeman (Nuka Market) to get the quest Free Season. Do the quest Free Season. Now, go to each part of the park to get the quests to free those places, without having to give them to the raiders (because they are dead). Also, you can restore the power to the Nuka-World. At this point, the only thing of value that you have lost is the unique weapon Aeternus, from the quest "Amoral Combat", whose trigger is, IIRC, finishing the quest "Home, Sweet Home" (The quest about enslaving the commonwealth). And, as I said, the radiant quests from the raiders, but f*** them. Anything else? You have access to it. And that's it, no console commands, no mods, and no pissed Preston. And if you want to give Cage an extra "f*** you", kill Colter with criticals to the head at the end of the gaunlet, ignoring the Thirsty Zapper. With criticals you can bypass his invulnerability. A pity Cage doesn't aknowlegde it and treats it as if you used the Zapper, but...
What I wanted to do, was go ahead, do the Nuka Quest lines, and not plant a single flag for any of the clans... I wanted to say, "Ok, Park is ready for moving in! So, go claim your territory, anyway you want." Making them fight each other, killing themselves off. Then I would only have 1 group left to deal with, and they should be quite weakened by this point, to make it a lot easier to slaughter.
And was Highly disappointed that I couldn't do this. And Home Sweet Home is where I jumped ship.
I don't like Preston, but his companion perk is actually pretty useful and I didn't get it on this playthrough, so I figured I'd let him tag along for a little longer.
He still gives you the same old quests and everything, he just can't be a companion and tells you how much he hates you everytime you talk to him, so there really isn't a benefit to "losing him" like most seem to think.
If you get the mod that lets you keep ownership of vassals, you can just send him to one to work. I got slavery furniture for my raider run as well, so now Preston talks about how much he hates me with a collar on shackled to the wall in the Slog. Much better.
Fallout died with that DLC anyway. why force you in certain direction? if it is "canon" they did a shitty job. now I'm missing Obsidian story telling...
Just do what I did and kill the raider scum. Hopefully Bethesda lets obsidian make future fallouts because clearly they have no idea what they are doing
yeah, kill the raiders and you have paid for a 10 minute dlc like all those settlement dlc bullshit, so it is basically not an option. great job there, beth, worst season pass ever.
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Note: Not complaint - just an amusing observation ^-^
that being said i still really enjoy the DLC,i just wish there was a raider gang that liked guns,because you've got the pack who like pure strength,the disciples who like knives,and the operators who like caps and dont give a f*#@ how they got them.
Also, there is no such thing as good and evil, it's all a matter of perspective. Raiders and Minutemen share the same goals, but have different approaches.
Turns out my character isn't good, he's just manipulative.
The people is hoarders, it doesnt matter if is good and evil as long you dont lose anything.
I mean if exist a mod that let you get the 4 main faction story a peaceful ending in order to get all benefits from them, one get it.
The disconnect is staggering to be honest.
The whole game pushes you down the good guy route, then you arrive at Nuka World and you're expected to become a raider boss and go evil.
So the raiders want to raid the Commonwealth for slaves... for what? What are these slaves going to be doing? The slave collars certainly aren't helping the Nuka-World market draw customers. What else could these slaves do to generate wealth that contented free men and women under the gangs 'protection' could not?
One of the key aspects of evil is selfishness and yet these raiders allow their pursuit of wealth and power to be interfered with by the psychotic blood lust of their comrades. That would never happen. Anyone hurting slaves or interfering with production would earn a bullet in the head. And in spite of one leader talking about how rules are not wanted mob bosses in the real world impose more laws and codes of behavior than normal people live by.
The smart move would be to free the slaves, invest them into a system that attracts others, build up an economy and town where the gangs are the police and government until enough wealth is flowing that someone builds a beach resort in the Bahamas. What the raiders want to do, however, is just small time crazy fighting over scraps like dogs in a junkyard. A leader doesn't need to be tough; he needs to be smart and these guys are miles away from that.
"The smart move would be to free the slaves, invest them into a system that attracts others, build up an economy and town where the gangs are the police and government until enough wealth is flowing that someone builds a beach resort in the Bahamas. "
That's pretty much how New Vegas came to be. Fallout NV had some good writing. :D
???????? Uh...in what universe? Minutemen want to make the Commonwealth safe and band the citizens together for the common good. Raiders are completely self-serving. Unless you know something I don't.
Also, there is no such thing as good and evil, it's all a matter of perspective. Raiders and Minutemen share the same goals, but have different approaches."
its true, there is no Human definition for "evil" humans are just driven to kill. stupid people put labels on actions that are disagreeable as evil or monstrous.
its like the military vs civilians Killing each other crap, military calls it Duty, civilians call it killing. Killing is killing, its part human primordial behavior.
while yes I did just justify death by another human, I myself do not happily accept such behavior, Im merely explaining a fact.
Advance through the camaign until you get the quest "The Grand Tour" (so basically, finish the gaunlet, talk with Cage and with the bosses of each raider gang). Look for Preston Garvey or Mackenzie Bridgeman (Nuka Market) to get the quest Free Season. Do the quest Free Season. Now, go to each part of the park to get the quests to free those places, without having to give them to the raiders (because they are dead). Also, you can restore the power to the Nuka-World. At this point, the only thing of value that you have lost is the unique weapon Aeternus, from the quest "Amoral Combat", whose trigger is, IIRC, finishing the quest "Home, Sweet Home" (The quest about enslaving the commonwealth). And, as I said, the radiant quests from the raiders, but f*** them. Anything else? You have access to it. And that's it, no console commands, no mods, and no pissed Preston. And if you want to give Cage an extra "f*** you", kill Colter with criticals to the head at the end of the gaunlet, ignoring the Thirsty Zapper. With criticals you can bypass his invulnerability. A pity Cage doesn't aknowlegde it and treats it as if you used the Zapper, but...
What I wanted to do, was go ahead, do the Nuka Quest lines, and not plant a single flag for any of the clans... I wanted to say, "Ok, Park is ready for moving in! So, go claim your territory, anyway you want." Making them fight each other, killing themselves off. Then I would only have 1 group left to deal with, and they should be quite weakened by this point, to make it a lot easier to slaughter.
And was Highly disappointed that I couldn't do this. And Home Sweet Home is where I jumped ship.
Thank you.
i haven't beat nuka world yet.... but this just made me more likely to beat it faster