This is a fantastic and absolutely great mod! I had some questions about it as I went through it. (I hope these don't sound pretentious because the work you've done already is great)
> How come "Super Dragon Twin Fists" isn't Chōryūsō-ken? > Isn't "Rapid Fire Kienzan" just "Kienretsuzan"? > With "Multiple Zanzōken", isn't it "Tajū Zanzōken"? Kuririn even says it when it's used. > Why is it "King Cold"? "King Cold" is written as "Great King Cold" in the Japanese text for the game. "大" is used a lot in the franchise, like Great Demon King Piccolo for instance. > Wouldn't "Kefla" be "Kafla" since it's [Ka]le and Cauli[fla] combined? Even VegettoEX agrees: https://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=43926 > Why does the mod include "Kaiōshin" and "Dai-kaishin", but "God of Destruction" and not "Hakaishin"? I understand that "Hakaishin" isn't exclusive to DragonBall--as you mention in the description--, but the Kaiōshin and Hakaishin are linked. I don't know, I just think it makes everything more consistent. > For Beerus, why is it "Destruction Ball" and "Super Destruction Ball" instead of "Hakai-Dama" and "Super Hakai-Dama"? Same with "Destruction Head Poke", why is it not "Hakai Head Poke" or "Hakai Dekopin"? > For Whis, the theme of his attacks is "Hakai no" and then an orchestra related word after. Hakai no Jokyoku, Hakai no Kōkyōkyoku, and Hakai no Shūkyoku. Why isn't it "Hakai Overture", "Hakai Symphony", and "Hakai Finale"? > I probably won't be agreed with here, but why is it "Bulma" and not "Blooma"? Her name is based off the undergarment "ブルマー" with the last "a" sound taken off, so that her name is spelled "ブルマ". This would be the equivalent of removing the "er" in "Bloomer". This one might be a stretch though haha.
*This might be nitpicky but in your description you wrote "Kame-Sen'nin", but in the mod the "s" is lowercased. I like the uppercased "S".
Side Note: I really appreciate that you made "Merged No. 13" and "Merged Zamasu" have consistent prefixes, since they both have "合体" before their names. And I appreciated you added Kuririn saying "Lunch" instead of "Launch" in the shop screen.
Strongly agree on the Hakaishin thing, but regarding Whis I think it's fine the way it is because it doesn't really make sense for him to literally be using Hakai energy as we understand it. I think it's odd that they named his moveset this way in the first place.
Thanks for the kind words, Handman! And no worries at all; please feel free to critique. This mod is aimed at the niche bit of the fandom you belong to, and it'll need your proofreading to make it great. I've been updating the mod in response to feedback and will keep doing so.
On Tajū Zanzōken: Where a named technique is modified (like Super Masenkō or Raging Masenkō) I decided to translate the modifier and leave the original name intact. "Tajū" means "multiple", so there we have it. (If you're wondering why, then, I have Chō-Makōhō, you'd be right to wonder, and I shall revisit that in an update... hey, I'm only human!)
On "Great King Cold": My (layman's) understanding is that it's agreeable for "daiō" to simply be translated as "King", the elements of "dai" and "ō" taken together. You mentioned "Great Demon King Piccolo", but then "daimaō" is commonly translated simply as "Demon King". Ultimately, not being able to speak Japanese, I referred to the decisions made by people who can at Kanzenshuu, who went with "King Cold" and "Demon King Piccolo". I applied the same logic to "King Enma" ("Enma-daiō").
On "God of Destruction" and "hakai": I'm afraid I can't offer more reasoning than is in the mod description. I'm cognizant of and appreciate that Hakaishin and Kaiōshin have a relationship, but I'm making that compromise (if those terms were introduced to us at the same time, I think we'd all be treating them differently). With that decision made, I've translated "hakai" accordingly wherever it appears—including Whis' moveset.
On "Blooma": I don't think you're stretching your undergarments too far at all. In fact, I agree with your logic here, and I suspect most fans in our neck of the woods do too (when the lights are off and the curtains are drawn). But with the most solid reasoning in the world, it's hard to divorce the hard logic from the fact that, when we first meet her, she's wearing a shirt bearing the letters "BULMA" in big block letters. (Sure, Kuririn has a "KULILIN" hat on Namek, but we'd already befriended him as "Kuririn" by then.) So, while I'm with you on the reasoning, I feel it's an impossible battle—the gal introduced herself. If nothing else, let's forever celebrate "Bulma" as the way Toriyama himself decided to Anglicise her name on his own terms.
If I haven't addressed one of your points above, it means I agree with you and will revisit that with a future update, so please look out for it!
If I have addressed something above, please know that I see where you're coming from and I'm not saying I'm married to these decisions forever; merely explaining why I haven't queued them up for an immediate update. There's no one correct way to adapt this world that we love. Your input is much appreciated, and I'll bear it in mind for the future!
Toriyama actually did change his romanization of Buruma in 2007. I keep forgetting what this is from, but notice the jacket that clearly has "BLOOMER" printed on it:
So I'd take any "official" romanizations found in Japanese DB media with a grain of salt, especially with other obviously false examples as "Sal" (Cell) and "Beedel" (Videl) that directly contradict the etymology of the respective names.
And this is unrelated, but "Hildegarn" is actually an overcorrection. "Hirudegarn" is, in fact, how it should be rendered, because that character's name comes from the fact that the director of the movie he comes from, Seiichi Hiruta, disliked his original design and asked for it to be changed. After he saw the new design, his jaw reportedly dropped, and ガーン (gān) is the onomatopoeia for jaw-dropping. Hence, "Hiruta" + "gān" = "Hirudegān" (which can also be rendered as "Hirudegarn" if you prefer). Steve Simmons was presumably not privy to this piece of trivia when he translated that movie's subtitles, so he went with "Hildegarn", possibly believing it to be a corruption of the Germanic name Hildegard.
there is wrong translate when piccolo merged with kami do the Makankōsappō in the official translate its says (ARE YOU IN PEACE) its (Are you READY) can you fix it please ?
I have a few suggestions for improving some move/character names - some straightforward, some more down to preference on my part - feel free to take a look!
This is fantastically helpful, thank you for taking the time to do it! I've included all of your recommended improvements in a new update!
On "shunkan-idō", I've kept it as "Instantaneous Movement" for now. I'm shamelessly partial to the literal translation because of my familiarity with the Simmons subtitles... but I'm on board with "Teleportation". Watch this space.
On "Full Power", the broad idea was to hyphenate it where it serves as an adjective, and not hyphenate it where it serves as a noun (eg. the state/condition of a character). I admit this is more a stylistic decision than a grammatical one...
Thanks again for these notes and suggestions, I really appreciate it!
I'm so glad you found my suggestions helpful! And fair point on the "Full Power" vs "Full-Power" thing, I hadn't thought of it that way!
While I'm at it, I was going through the new update and noticed a few names seem to have gotten overlooked. On the off-chance this was an error and not an intentional choice on your part, I've listed them below:
Lastly, I happened to think of one more suggestion since I made my last comment - it's another one more down to personal preference so feel free to disregard it, but figured I'd post it and my reasoning behind it, just in case you find it at all helpful:
- "Son Gohan (Adolescence)" -> "Son Gohan (Youth)" (since "Adult" Gohan in this game is meant to represent both him in the Boo Arc where he's 17*, and Super where he's in his early 20s, I think "Youth" splits the difference a bit better than "Adolescence" - plus the game already translates "青年期" as "Youth" with the NPC "Dende (Youth)", so there is precedent on this)
That's all I think! Thank you for all your work on this mod!
Thanks, I'll fix those in the next update. (I'll also go with "teleportation".) Your suggestion of "(Youth)" makes sense as well, I'll have a think about it!
This is amazing. Exactly what this game needed. Being forced to see "Vegito Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan" really wrecks me. Actually I've been wanting this for all Dragon Ball games, so being able to achieve it now finally is a blessing.
I will be following this project with great interest.
Vegito is changed to "Vegetto" of course, but it still says "Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan", since that's what's there in the Japanese version of the game. I prefer "Vegetto Blue", but ultimately I'm here to change things to be closer to the original.
I can see how saying "Original Japanese" in the mod's name might throw you off there. I'm not using Japanese words without changes. The terms used are faithfully adapted for English-speaking fans, as opposed to terms being derived from the American version. The idea is that the terms used will be the ones familiar to English-speaking fans of the original (Japanese language) version.
To that end, with Saiyan not only being a faithful adaptation of "saiya-jin" to English but also the one familiar to most English-speaking fans of the Japanese language version, that is the word I've used.
Sorry to say it like this, but that sounds pretty biased. One might say the same about Tien Shinhan being faithful when compared to Tenshinhan, or (like you mentioned) Geran to Jiren which even sounds identical, so where do you draw the line? I am pretty sure that many people view "saiyajin" as bastardization of the original name, just like the examples listed in the description. And considering most people playing with this mod will use the Japanese voices, it does make it sort of immersion breaking when you can clearly hear Goku shouting "saiyajin".
Don't take this the wrong way though. I'm thrilled that this mod finally exist and I've already endorsed it, and it's totally fair that the guy who does the job is able to take some liberties for himself. I'm just kind of confused because of all the little details that are covered here, then this part which seems increcibly obvious to me is left as is.
Apetissen2 I disagree. It wouldn't even be Saiyajin in the first place but Saiya-jin with a hyphen. Saiya-jin or サイヤ人 can literally be translated as "Saiya People". Saiya being an anagram of Yasai, the japanese word for vegetable. The "jin" portion--meaning people--is also found in the names of the people of Earth, the people of Namek, and the people of Tsufru (Chikyū-jin, Namekku-jin, and Tsufuru-jin respectfully). "Saiyan" is a good approximation to match while also still keeping the meaning of the word. It would certainly be better than straight translating it as "Saiya People", even though that's what it literally means, because the suffix "-jin", in Japanese, is equivalent to things like -an or -n, or -ese in the English language.
You said "it does make it sort of immersion breaking when you can clearly hear Goku shouting "saiyajin"", but they are speaking an entirely different language. A lot of what is being said won't sound exactly the same when translated. It would be weird to see an Earthling be called a Chikyū-jin even if that is what is literally being said. This is why Trunks is called Trunks and not Torankasu or Vegeta and not Bejīta. What you want reminds of the meme when fans translate what Light Yagami says in Death Note, 計画通り, as "All according to Keikaku* *Keikaku means plan".
I can't speak for Nocky, but from what I can tell, this mod is trying to be a faithful localization for the American audience, not straight Romanization of names.
Btw, I hope what I said doesn't come off as snobby or as if I'm better than you. I just wanted to add my two cents into the discussion.
And if after all of this you still don't agree with me, this is an official song sung by Vegeta's own voice actor Ryō Horikawa where he literally says "Saiyan"--not Saiya-jin--during the English portions of the song "Saiyan Blood": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pMiNCJrAVU&t=90s
@kanasandx You bring a lot of good points here, even with some information that's new to me. Although it feels less jarring now after you made your points, I still stand by my own opinion here. First and foremost if there is a hyphen or not in the word wouldn't matter to me personally as both are widely used (just like many use "Son-Goku") and sound identical. After all I rarely see people freak out when tons of people write "Spider-Man" without a hyphen. The point that it doesn't have to sound the same because it is a foreign language kind of defeats the purpose of this mod though. "Genki-dama" is just Japanese for "energy orb/sphere" after all, but it is the name that is given to that specific fantasy technique, which also would be the same for the specific alien race which are referred to as "saiya-jin" (which is also what most translations call them tbf). Earthlings and humans are not fantasy races and we have real words for these in all languages, so that's not really a black and white comparison, but as for having the people of Namek being "Namekku-jin" wouldn't bother me in the slightest.
Again for me personally the biggest gripe about it is when you hear the characters say stuff like "Super saiya-jin Son Goku", but the text does not reflect the same, then it breaks the illusion.
And no, I don't feel like you come off as cocky (not any more than I do anyway lmao), so no hard feelings. Also that song has somehow flown below my radar, and it absolutely slaps! Thank you for showing it to me!
This is not a retranslation of the game. As noted in the description, I'll go out of my way to replace egregiously bad or memey subtitles, but because that one doesn't fit either scenario I'm not likely to change it.
More of what I found while going through the mod. When I have the time I'll go through the rest of the story mode: https://imgur.com/a/what-i-found-2-Db3z8sb
50 comments
> How come "Super Dragon Twin Fists" isn't Chōryūsō-ken?
> Isn't "Rapid Fire Kienzan" just "Kienretsuzan"?
> With "Multiple Zanzōken", isn't it "Tajū Zanzōken"? Kuririn even says it when it's used.
> Why is it "King Cold"? "King Cold" is written as "Great King Cold" in the Japanese text for the game. "大" is used a lot in the franchise, like Great Demon King Piccolo for instance.
> Wouldn't "Kefla" be "Kafla" since it's [Ka]le and Cauli[fla] combined? Even VegettoEX agrees: https://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=43926
> Why does the mod include "Kaiōshin" and "Dai-kaishin", but "God of Destruction" and not "Hakaishin"? I understand that "Hakaishin" isn't exclusive to DragonBall--as you mention in the description--, but the Kaiōshin and Hakaishin are linked. I don't know, I just think it makes everything more consistent.
> For Beerus, why is it "Destruction Ball" and "Super Destruction Ball" instead of "Hakai-Dama" and "Super Hakai-Dama"? Same with "Destruction Head Poke", why is it not "Hakai Head Poke" or "Hakai Dekopin"?
> For Whis, the theme of his attacks is "Hakai no" and then an orchestra related word after. Hakai no Jokyoku, Hakai no Kōkyōkyoku, and Hakai no Shūkyoku. Why isn't it "Hakai Overture", "Hakai Symphony", and "Hakai Finale"?
> I probably won't be agreed with here, but why is it "Bulma" and not "Blooma"? Her name is based off the undergarment "ブルマー" with the last "a" sound taken off, so that her name is spelled "ブルマ". This would be the equivalent of removing the "er" in "Bloomer". This one might be a stretch though haha.
*This might be nitpicky but in your description you wrote "Kame-Sen'nin", but in the mod the "s" is lowercased. I like the uppercased "S".
Side Note: I really appreciate that you made "Merged No. 13" and "Merged Zamasu" have consistent prefixes, since they both have "合体" before their names. And I appreciated you added Kuririn saying "Lunch" instead of "Launch" in the shop screen.
Again, great mod!
If I haven't addressed one of your points above, it means I agree with you and will revisit that with a future update, so please look out
for it!
If I have addressed something above, please know that I see where you're coming from and I'm not saying I'm married to these decisions forever; merely explaining why I haven't queued them up for an immediate update. There's no one correct way to adapt this world that we love. Your input is much appreciated, and I'll bear it in mind for the future!
And this is unrelated, but "Hildegarn" is actually an overcorrection. "Hirudegarn" is, in fact, how it should be rendered, because that character's name comes from the fact that the director of the movie he comes from, Seiichi Hiruta, disliked his original design and asked for it to be changed. After he saw the new design, his jaw reportedly dropped, and ガーン (gān) is the onomatopoeia for jaw-dropping. Hence, "Hiruta" + "gān" = "Hirudegān" (which can also be rendered as "Hirudegarn" if you prefer). Steve Simmons was presumably not privy to this piece of trivia when he translated that movie's subtitles, so he went with "Hildegarn", possibly believing it to be a corruption of the Germanic name Hildegard.
I have a few suggestions for improving some move/character names - some straightforward, some more down to preference on my part - feel free to take a look!
https://pastebin.com/yQ0i16Kn
On "shunkan-idō", I've kept it as "Instantaneous Movement" for now. I'm shamelessly partial to the literal translation because of my familiarity with the Simmons subtitles... but I'm on board with "Teleportation". Watch this space.
On "Full Power", the broad idea was to hyphenate it where it serves as an adjective, and not hyphenate it where it serves as a noun (eg. the state/condition of a character). I admit this is more a stylistic decision than a grammatical one...
Thanks again for these notes and suggestions, I really appreciate it!
While I'm at it, I was going through the new update and noticed a few names seem to have gotten overlooked. On the off-chance this was an error and not an intentional choice on your part, I've listed them below:
- "Silent Assassin No. 13" -> "Silent Assassin 13"
- "Tsufruian Revenger" -> "Tsufru Revenger"
- "Spread Energy Blast" -> "Scattering Energy Bullets"
- "Infinity Flasher" -> "Infinite Flasher"
- "Clash Ultra Boo-Boo Volleyball" -> "Crashing Ultra Boo-Boo Volleyball"
Lastly, I happened to think of one more suggestion since I made my last comment - it's another one more down to personal preference so feel free to disregard it, but figured I'd post it and my reasoning behind it, just in case you find it at all helpful:
- "Son Gohan (Adolescence)" -> "Son Gohan (Youth)" (since "Adult" Gohan in this game is meant to represent both him in the Boo Arc where he's 17*, and Super where he's in his early 20s, I think "Youth" splits the difference a bit better than "Adolescence" - plus the game already translates "青年期" as "Youth" with the NPC "Dende (Youth)", so there is precedent on this)
That's all I think! Thank you for all your work on this mod!
Edit: Changes made in the latest update
Actually I've been wanting this for all Dragon Ball games, so being able to achieve it now finally is a blessing.
I will be following this project with great interest.
Vegito is changed to "Vegetto" of course, but it still says "Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan", since that's what's there in the Japanese version of the game. I prefer "Vegetto Blue", but ultimately I'm here to change things to be closer to the original.
To that end, with Saiyan not only being a faithful adaptation of "saiya-jin" to English but also the one familiar to most English-speaking fans of the Japanese language version, that is the word I've used.
I am pretty sure that many people view "saiyajin" as bastardization of the original name, just like the examples listed in the description. And considering most people playing with this mod will use the Japanese voices, it does make it sort of immersion breaking when you can clearly hear Goku shouting "saiyajin".
Don't take this the wrong way though. I'm thrilled that this mod finally exist and I've already endorsed it, and it's totally fair that the guy who does the job is able to take some liberties for himself. I'm just kind of confused because of all the little details that are covered here, then this part which seems increcibly obvious to me is left as is.
I can't speak for Nocky, but from what I can tell, this mod is trying to be a faithful localization for the American audience, not straight Romanization of names.
Btw, I hope what I said doesn't come off as snobby or as if I'm better than you. I just wanted to add my two cents into the discussion.
And if after all of this you still don't agree with me, this is an official song sung by Vegeta's own voice actor Ryō Horikawa where he literally says "Saiyan"--not Saiya-jin--during the English portions of the song "Saiyan Blood": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pMiNCJrAVU&t=90s
First and foremost if there is a hyphen or not in the word wouldn't matter to me personally as both are widely used (just like many use "Son-Goku") and sound identical. After all I rarely see people freak out when tons of people write "Spider-Man" without a hyphen.
The point that it doesn't have to sound the same because it is a foreign language kind of defeats the purpose of this mod though. "Genki-dama" is just Japanese for "energy orb/sphere" after all, but it is the name that is given to that specific fantasy technique, which also would be the same for the specific alien race which are referred to as "saiya-jin" (which is also what most translations call them tbf). Earthlings and humans are not fantasy races and we have real words for these in all languages, so that's not really a black and white comparison, but as for having the people of Namek being "Namekku-jin" wouldn't bother me in the slightest.
Again for me personally the biggest gripe about it is when you hear the characters say stuff like "Super saiya-jin Son Goku", but the text does not reflect the same, then it breaks the illusion.
And no, I don't feel like you come off as cocky (not any more than I do anyway lmao), so no hard feelings. Also that song has somehow flown below my radar, and it absolutely slaps! Thank you for showing it to me!
https://imgur.com/a/what-i-found-2-Db3z8sb
https://imgur.com/a/yh6itTM
I was always on the fence with "Garlic" and "Galic" but I've decided to update it to the latter.