The Dragon Age wiki states that the templar armour will show up backwards on Elves. But, if I were to hazard a guess, that would probably be a model / mesh issue -and not related to the material of said armour? Would that be correctible -if at all? Or would it take a complete re-modelling of the armour specifically for the elves? Because that sounds both arduous and labour intensive -not to mention the technical know-how that is required to make the necessary changes. Personally, I don't know anything about working with mesh files or DAO modding. (Let's just say I managed to bork my entire game by attempting to make a script to add something to the game. That sort of cured my curiosity to mod for DAO). Anyway, I'll stop rambling.
That would be an issue with the mesh. I don't do 3d modeling, so I'm not sure what the fix would be for something like that.
I did put the armor on a female elf Warden (which the wiki specifically says is the bugged model), with no mods installed at all, and the chest equips correctly... no idea why, if it is supposed to be bugged.
All of the Templar NPCs in DAO, including Greagoir, are equipped with the same chest (gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp.uti; the DA wiki is incorrect in stating that they wear gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp_a.uti). Most of the Templars in Awakening wear that chest as well, though some are equipped with either gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp_a.uti (fixed tier, Steel) or gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp_b.uti (fixed Tier, Silverite).
The material scaling for gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp.uti is ID 46 (Armor, All Metal), with the lowest tier available to the item being ID 1 (Armor, Iron). The tier at which a variable tier item will spawn is is determined by some formula or script (determined by either the NPCs level or the level of the player character), and an NPC may spawn with items of varying tiers, similar to the way loot will spawn within a range of tiers for the player character. But there's no way to force variable tier items to spawn at a specific tier.
As for the file you've linked to, I have no idea what it is doing or even what changes Qwinn makes to the Templar gear... my fix is intended to be used as a fix for the vanilla items, to standardize the material and tier of the items worn by all Templar NPCs, and so it will by necessity conflict with any other mod that alters the same item files.
Thank you for the detailed explanation. So looks like what's happening is Magi origin templars' gauntlets are scaling to my level (as iron with Qwinn's fixpack or your mod installed), while their amours are spawning as steel or above due to Bioware's artistic choice or the respective characters' levels. Hence, the discrepancy shown in the picture of the vanilla templar gauntlets modder's screenshot.
The vanilla material and material scaling of the Templar armor set items is:
gen_im_arm_glv_mas_tem.uti 87 Armor, Templar / 46 Armor, All Metal[gauntlets] gen_im_arm_hel_mas_tmp.uti1 Armor, Iron / 46 Armor, All Metal[helmet] Chest: gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp.uti1 Armor, Iron / 46 Armor, All Metal[chest] Chest: gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp_a.uti 8 Armor, Steel / 25 Armor, Steel[chest] Chest: gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp_b.uti 3 Armor, Silverite / 27 Armor, Silverite[chest; Knight Commander's Plate] gen_im_arm_bot_mas_tmp.uti1 Armor, Iron / 46 Armor, All Metal[boots, no model assigned] gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tem.uti 3 Armor, Silverite / 27 Armor, Silverite[chest; Armor of the Divine Will; different model, so not really 'Templar' armour]
(The numeric values are the variation IDs assigned to the materials and material scaling. A variable tier item is assigned a material that is the lowest possible tier it can spawn at. The material scaling determines the limits that it can scale to. So in DAO, an item with Armor, Iron as the material and Armor, All Metal as the material scaling, can spawn with (and be scaled up or down to) any material tier. An item with Armor, Steel and Armor, All Metal will spawn with a minimum tier of T3 Steel, up to T7 Dragonbone. An item with Armor Steel as the material and Armor, Steel as the material scaling will always spawn at and be fixed at that tier.)
The 'Templar' material used by the vanilla gloves is not used by any other armor in the game, as far as I could tell, and it's certainly not used by any other Templar armor item.
All I've done with the gloves give them the same Armor, Iron material / Armor, All Metal material scaling as the helmet and chest used by every Templar NPC in DAO. They'll spawn at a level that is appropriate for either the player character or the NPC using the item (whichever is the formula used by the core files; I don't have access to the toolset so I can't dig for that information), and that spawn will be within a range that is appropriate, rather than a set tier. So, for instance, the chest may spawn as T3 Steel, but the helm could be T4 Veridium and the gloves T2 Grey Iron.
But there's no way to force a variable tier item to spawn with a specific material for aesthetic reasons.
In response to post #61434777. #61435302 is also a reply to the same post.
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SpiritWarden wrote: I tried this but I seem to have a different issue. The Templar's gloves have a slight reddish colour to them and this fix doesn't solve it. Any idea what might be causing it?
theskymoves wrote: *scratches head* A lot of the metal material tiers have reddish tints, but I didn't touch the actual tints or do anything to change how the game determines what level to spawn items. All I did was make the gloves use the same material leveling criteria as the other Templar pieces, rather than being a fixed T1.
Sorry to not be more helpful. :-(
It's okay, I installed a tmp mod called 'less gaudy tints', that got rid of the red colour and your mod made the gloves match the armour afterwards. Thanks
tmp's mod is a good one; I sometimes used it in my game.
My apologies for inadvertently creating a visual issue in your game... it's a good thing I don't mod anymore, when stuff like this happens!
I tried this but I seem to have a different issue. The Templar's gloves have a slight reddish colour to them and this fix doesn't solve it. Any idea what might be causing it?
*scratches head* A lot of the metal material tiers have reddish tints, but I didn't touch the actual tints or do anything to change how the game determines what level to spawn items. All I did was make the gloves use the same material leveling criteria as the other Templar pieces, rather than being a fixed T1.
It's okay, I installed a tmp mod called 'less gaudy tints', that got rid of the red colour and your mod made the gloves match the armour afterwards. Thanks :)
16 comments
Anyone who comments to just say they don't like the mod will be blocked from my content.
Constructive criticism is fine. Informing me that you personally have no use for a mod is of no value.
But, if I were to hazard a guess, that would probably be a model / mesh issue -and not related to the material of said armour?
Would that be correctible -if at all?
Or would it take a complete re-modelling of the armour specifically for the elves? Because that sounds both arduous and labour intensive -not to mention the technical know-how that is required to make the necessary changes.
Personally, I don't know anything about working with mesh files or DAO modding.
(Let's just say I managed to bork my entire game by attempting to make a script to add something to the game. That sort of cured my curiosity to mod for DAO). Anyway, I'll stop rambling.
I did put the armor on a female elf Warden (which the wiki specifically says is the bugged model), with no mods installed at all, and the chest equips correctly... no idea why, if it is supposed to be bugged.
On a sidenote, what staff is your warden carrying?
https://www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/5967?tab=description
Is it possible to downgrade Greagoir's armor to iron, or upgrade regular templars to wear same material as Greagoir?
Thank you.
The material scaling for gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp.uti is ID 46 (Armor, All Metal), with the lowest tier available to the item being ID 1 (Armor, Iron). The tier at which a variable tier item will spawn is is determined by some formula or script (determined by either the NPCs level or the level of the player character), and an NPC may spawn with items of varying tiers, similar to the way loot will spawn within a range of tiers for the player character. But there's no way to force variable tier items to spawn at a specific tier.
As for the file you've linked to, I have no idea what it is doing or even what changes Qwinn makes to the Templar gear... my fix is intended to be used as a fix for the vanilla items, to standardize the material and tier of the items worn by all Templar NPCs, and so it will by necessity conflict with any other mod that alters the same item files.
So looks like what's happening is Magi origin templars' gauntlets are scaling to my level (as iron with Qwinn's fixpack or your mod installed), while their amours are spawning as steel or above due to Bioware's artistic choice or the respective characters' levels.
Hence, the discrepancy shown in the picture of the vanilla templar gauntlets modder's screenshot.
gen_im_arm_glv_mas_tem.uti 87 Armor, Templar / 46 Armor, All Metal[gauntlets]
gen_im_arm_hel_mas_tmp.uti1 Armor, Iron / 46 Armor, All Metal[helmet]
Chest: gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp.uti1 Armor, Iron / 46 Armor, All Metal[chest]
Chest: gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp_a.uti 8 Armor, Steel / 25 Armor, Steel[chest]
Chest: gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tmp_b.uti 3 Armor, Silverite / 27 Armor, Silverite[chest; Knight Commander's Plate]
gen_im_arm_bot_mas_tmp.uti1 Armor, Iron / 46 Armor, All Metal[boots, no model assigned]
gen_im_arm_cht_mas_tem.uti 3 Armor, Silverite / 27 Armor, Silverite[chest; Armor of the Divine Will; different model, so not really 'Templar' armour]
(The numeric values are the variation IDs assigned to the materials and material scaling. A variable tier item is assigned a material that is the lowest possible tier it can spawn at. The material scaling determines the limits that it can scale to. So in DAO, an item with Armor, Iron as the material and Armor, All Metal as the material scaling, can spawn with (and be scaled up or down to) any material tier. An item with Armor, Steel and Armor, All Metal will spawn with a minimum tier of T3 Steel, up to T7 Dragonbone. An item with Armor Steel as the material and Armor, Steel as the material scaling will always spawn at and be fixed at that tier.)
The 'Templar' material used by the vanilla gloves is not used by any other armor in the game, as far as I could tell, and it's certainly not used by any other Templar armor item.
All I've done with the gloves give them the same Armor, Iron material / Armor, All Metal material scaling as the helmet and chest used by every Templar NPC in DAO. They'll spawn at a level that is appropriate for either the player character or the NPC using the item (whichever is the formula used by the core files; I don't have access to the toolset so I can't dig for that information), and that spawn will be within a range that is appropriate, rather than a set tier. So, for instance, the chest may spawn as T3 Steel, but the helm could be T4 Veridium and the gloves T2 Grey Iron.
But there's no way to force a variable tier item to spawn with a specific material for aesthetic reasons.
tmp's mod is a good one; I sometimes used it in my game.
My apologies for inadvertently creating a visual issue in your game... it's a good thing I don't mod anymore, when stuff like this happens!
Sorry to not be more helpful. :-(