Is there a way to protect self from "Her Voice" aka "The Absolute" passive feature? (my character have 8 int so i can take like 50-60 dmg before i can resist it at least once, and it can proc many times)
Maybe change saving throw from int to something every character has? Maybe DEX or CON?
That's the point. These are dangerous powers: there should be a risk to using them if you aren't built for it. That said, Warped Headband of Intellect sets your INT to 17, Aberration Hunters' Amulet gives Advantage on INT saves (if you're Githyanki), and many other items and effects give Advantage on saves.
Edit: I'm pinning this thread because everyone should read it before complaining.
On one hand I agree, on another hand I feel it's far too punishing - if you end up with any more than three stacks you're pretty much guaranteed to die. I think the damage should be decreased and there should be a limit to the number of turns it runs - and perhaps the closer to said limit, the easier the skill check. Also, you could try adding some mod configuration menu options. TL;DR it's far too easy for the effect to become overpowering, making even a single power use too much of a risk to be worth the reward.
I understand it's a big change from vanilla, where there's no consequences at all. I made a deliberate choice not to explain how it works, but it's really not that bad once you figure it out.
Each time you use an active or toggled illithid power (e.g., Charm or Cull the Weak), you make an INT save. The DC is 12 to 16. If you fail, you get a stack of Her Voice, which does 1d6 Psychic damage and reduces your INT, WIS, and CHA by 1 per turn remaining. Each turn, you make an INT save to remove a stack.
If you can't keep up with the damage, you dial back the illithid power spam.
I tested it on an Eldritch Knight with 19 INT--no other bonuses, just +4 to INT saves--and I struggled to even get 3 stacks. The only way you're getting 3+ is if you're a) not built for it or b) not playing around it.
The only way you're getting 3+ is if you're a) not built for it or b) not playing around it.This is a problem. You shouldn't be forced to "build for it" or "play around it" to use what is supposed to be a prominent gameplay feature. You're locking the feature away from a decent chunk of players and then claiming you've made it "better". This isn't better, this is "play the game the way I am playing".
P.S. 19 int is way, way higher than average. 19 anything is higher than normal. You shouldn't base your tests around someone with a nearly maxed stat.
If the mod is to remain in this state not only am I going to have to remove it, I certainly won't be recommending it to anyone.
shame too, it looks like such a good mod, just ruined by an exponential punishment curve that makes it nigh impossible to use with most builds. I still suggest adding some mod configuration options, or at least actually looking at how the drawback affects players who aren't high-int builds. I don't think you are truly grasping how much the difficulty is changed depending on a character's int. This drawback system is not well-thought-out from any point of view.
Honestly, you're right. It's a divisive change. There should probably be two versions. But at the end of the day, I make the mods I want to use. My answer to multiple versions is that anyone can make and publish the version they want. I set the permissions that way on purpose, and 1.0 and 1.1 are still up.
Good to know, I'll probably look into that. I'm sorry I got a little more offensive about it than I meant to, I was having a bit of a rough day and unfairly took it out on this thread.
This "her voice" is just ridiculous sometimes. my astarion is lvl 10, he have 130 hp and after fight he had just 2 stacks of this status effect. when i alt tab to answer someone in messanger and do some other things, he died. Lvl 10 character with 8 int and 130 HP succes this check 0 times and just died. If this effect were timed (like 10 turns, each stack +10 turns) or rebalanced to need CON saving throw, then everything would be good, but now it's just funny how unfunny this mechanic is. I will personally move to illithid powers overhaul after this playthrough
You can switch now. It should be safe to remove mid-playthrough. I assume you didn't read the rest of this thread, or you would understand that a) if you choose to use 1.2, INT is no longer a dump stat, and b) you don't have to use 1.2.
That said, either you were extremely unlucky or you're leaving out some vital information. Two stacks will take you to 6 INT for a -2 modifier to INT saves and do 7 Psychic damage per turn on average. The DC is 16, so you have to roll 18 or above. To go from 130 HP to 0 without passing a single save, you would have to fail 19 times in a row. To die, you would have to fail another three times in a row. The chances of that happening are 4.6% and 2.8%, respectively.
However, if you're using the Risky Ring, which gives Disadvantage on all saves, those probabilities shoot up to 64.9% and 60.6%.
Out of turn-based mode, each turn is six seconds, so you went AFK with an intentionally deadly debuff ticking for two minutes. I'm honestly not sure what you expected to happen.
I love what you did and please dont give too much about what is being said here.
This mechanic is not punishing at all; it just requires adjusting and actually considering.
I do not know what the people above are doing, but it seems like they use their powers on min(or close to min) INT characters wantonly with no abilities up to grant better saves and no gear related to it either... At which point, yeah. You are an idiot; you should get punished.
thats strange opinion. im agree, that should be some kickback for usage illithid powers, but based on int doing this powers useless for all nonint classes, which is much more then other classes. and if it was just about her voice - but this mod also reduce charisma in 3rd act after part. ceremorphosis, so its make unplayable nonint charackters.
Using illithid powers is a choice. Accepting Partial Ceremorphosis is a choice. Choices have consequences. In this case, you're trading -2 CON and CHA for +2 INT and nine new powers. It's like multiclassing. No class is "unplayable" because you multiclass, but if you're trying to optimize, you do have to weigh the pros and cons.
im play with mods, like arcane vanguard, which use intelligence on weapon atacks, or warlock with weapon pact, and some units with very big amount of hp dies in 2-3 strikes. in example i killed grim with 1000+hp (im also use mods on increase enemy's hp) by 2 strikes.
Ok yeah, that's not ideal. I would think that any wizard spells and cantrips with attack rolls would also proc it. I'll include a fix in the next update.
Do you have any suggestions other than just removing it? For instance, I could make it so stronger enemies (e.g., those with >= 100 HP, either max or current) or certain enemy types (e.g., undead and constructs) are immune.
mb its would be good if its wouldnt work just with "magic" stats (int, wis, ch) because other stats commonly harder to remove, and its would be good if would be 1 stat per cast (magic missile and other multitarget spells can remove stat on first hit. just constructs or undead not enough i think, because of some strong beasts have also low int and ch stats, but limit for current hp sounds good (max its bad idea, because little enemies will dies by damage earlier, then its stat becomes 0, its funny for strong enemies, but its should be not so op), mb max 50 hp would be nice (100 its too much i think)
Hmm yeah. I'm not sure how to make it proc on, say, Extra Attack but not Magic Missile or Eldritch Blast. Low INT/CHA are more common, but there's also bosses with low enough DEX that ranged attacks could trivialize them. I agree basing it on current HP would be better. The idea is that above 100 (or 50, etc.), you could still build stacks of Ability Drain, but Atrophied wouldn't proc. I might be able to make it scale off tadpole powers like Cull the Weak. Maybe 2X or 4X. 4X would be up to 60 HP before Partial Ceremorphosis and up to 100 after. That feels kinda weird and unintuitive though. It might be better to just remove it.
and i think thats one more disbalanced thing in your mod - "Her voice" ability have int save DC, and partial ceremorphosis removes 2 ch, so you make very annoying gameplay for nonintelligent casters - they should have with some way high int (17 can be from circlet of intelligence from 1st Act) or always die from her voice or dont use this abilities at all, and in 3rd Act they loose their spellcasting ability and talking proficiences. so i thing its would be enough to remove just constitution
Cool mod, i like the risk of using Illithid powers and making Intelligence more important to save from Her voice. I think the mod should buff the ring of mind shielding from Omelleum (a rather useless item) to make you immune to Her voice if using tier 0 and 1 powers, or maybe just resistance to psychic damage, or maybe even both?
I thought about doing something with that. Maybe have it give you advantage on the save. I just haven't really had time to work on mod stuff since school started.
I think I would do +2 INT rather than +2 WIS since illithids are more INT based, but that's not a bad idea. I'll release an update when I get a chance.
so i have this issue where black hole does not pull anything at all, any help? it only shows a red vertical line above targets with no movement applied
possibly i suppose but i have no other mods that affect illithid powers. ive got 5e spells and combat extender, those are probably the only 2 that it could be, everything else is cosmetic
ya ive just done a fresh install of bg3 and its still giving the straight vertical red lines for the pull and nothing actually moves. im not sure what to do about this. any suggestions?
Just to be clear, you're testing it with no other mods active? I'll test it again in my game. I guess you could unpack the mod, delete the changes to Black Hole, and repack it.
In Spell_Target.txt, delete
new entry "Target_TAD_BlackHole" type "SpellData" data "SpellType" "Target" using "Target_TAD_BlackHole" data "SpellProperties" "Force(-6,TargetToEntity,Neutral,false,true);GROUND:ApplyStatus(SELF,TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA,100,10)" data "AreaRadius" "6" data "Description" "h4a03134fgd645g4abagbc01g37e615a07bb7;1" data "DescriptionParams" "10" data "ExtraDescription" "" data "TooltipStatusApply" "ApplyStatus(TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA,100,10)" data "SpellFlags" "IsHarmful;DisableBlood;IsConcentration"
new entry "Target_TAD_BlackHole_Recast" type "SpellData" data "SpellType" "Target" using "Target_TAD_BlackHole" data "Cooldown" "" data "SpellProperties" "Force(-6,TargetToEntity,Neutral,false,true)" data "Description" "ha4249006g8b93g4925g9fb7g45d5d2b4ce5c;1" data "TooltipStatusApply" "" data "SpellFlags" "IsHarmful;DisableBlood;Temporary"
new entry "Target_MF_BlackHole" type "SpellData" data "SpellType" "Target" using "Target_TAD_BlackHole_Recast" data "Cooldown" "OncePerTurn" data "SpellProperties" "Force(-6,TargetToEntity,false,true);DealDamage(3d4,Force,Magical)" data "TooltipDamageList" "DealDamage(3d4,Force)" data "SpellFlags" "IsHarmful;DisableBlood;Wildshape" In Status_BOOST.txt, delete
new entry "MF_BLACK_HOLE_SLOW" type "StatusData" data "StatusType" "BOOST" using "MF_BLACK_HOLE_SLOW" data "DescriptionParams" "DealDamage(3d4,Force)" data "OnApplyFunctors" "" and
new entry "TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA" type "StatusData" data "StatusType" "BOOST" using "TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA" data "Description" "hb113a562g9443g4153ga7cfg2d0e813b8f35;1" data "StatusPropertyFlags" ""
ok so it does in fact seem to be working now, but not consistently. and the arrows that should show pull direction/distance always show as just vertical red. most enemies get pulled, i guess maybe there is a saving throw that stops some from being pulled? im not sure about that part cause it doesnt say anything like "saved" over them when they dont get pulled
Is that without mods and/or with those edits? There's definitely no saving throw. Some enemies are immune to forced movement, but I don't think it's common.
Can you add a version which makes Luck of the Far Realms and Freecast available once per combat? For Luck of the Far Realms, I find in ActionResourceDefinitions.lsx you can replenish every turn but not once per combat. Additionally, can you make Perilous Stakes be able to cast on enemies in honour mode? Thanks anyway.
I don't do multiple versions as a rule, but I can offer suggestions if you want to make your own edits. If OncePerCombat doesn't work in ActionResourceDefinitions, you could change it so it only costs a reaction but applies a hidden status that prevents you from using it again until combat ends. For Perilous Stakes, just change TargetConditions.
nvm my other comment but it seems like it is a slight nerf in the action economy. you can use 1 illithid power for free but the other illithid powers still consumes actions instead of bonus actions
It's debatable. In vanilla, Awakened is necessary to make most illithid powers viable. Now vanilla Awakened is sort of redundant since those powers are already bonus actions. Most effects are also stronger.
It doesn't change how you unlock powers, so it should be compatible with the mod you mentioned.
I don't know then. I do leave some as actions for balance reasons. If Concentrated Blast is a bonus action, it's probably working as intended. I can tell you how to revert the change to Awakened if you want. You could also use something like Toggleable Zaith'isk Awakened Passive. That should overwrite my changes.
I m curios does this mod work with the mod that lets you have the illithid powers from the astral tadpole once you unlocked the illithid powers in generell ? This one https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/2337
Presumably *not* compatible with Siael's Illithid Powers Overhaul... but I'm wondering if there other obvious/potential conflicts? Testing now (on my idiosyncratic 900+ mod load order), but if ya got thoughts on such, shout.
Heya. I took a quick look. I think it's gonna be an either/or thing. Think of this as a more lightweight option that tries to preserve the vanilla feel of the system.
Hadn't considered the "more lightweight option that tries to preserve the vanilla feel of the system" factor... which I kinda prefer, now that I think about it. I had run Siael's mod for a while until some messiness in re: the Patch 6 + Script Extender agida back circa February (along with various of Belinn's tadpole mods, and prolly some other things I'm forgetting), and so had dropped it from the load order since & have been looking for an alternative. Lightweight deltas that preserve the vanilla feel kinda hits the sweet spot imo. So, thx!
Wondering: what happens if your Tav is already fully tadpoled when this mod is installed on an existing save?
Everything should work as intended except Awakened. If you already have it, it'll be in your spellbook but not on your hotbar. My solution for testing was to put it on a ring and equip and unequip it. I'm trying to think of a better solution.
Edit: I rereleased 1.0 with a fix. Hopefully that still shows up for the people who already downloaded it.
59 comments
(my character have 8 int so i can take like 50-60 dmg before i can resist it at least once, and it can proc many times)
Maybe change saving throw from int to something every character has? Maybe DEX or CON?
Edit: I'm pinning this thread because everyone should read it before complaining.
TL;DR it's far too easy for the effect to become overpowering, making even a single power use too much of a risk to be worth the reward.
Each time you use an active or toggled illithid power (e.g., Charm or Cull the Weak), you make an INT save. The DC is 12 to 16. If you fail, you get a stack of Her Voice, which does 1d6 Psychic damage and reduces your INT, WIS, and CHA by 1 per turn remaining. Each turn, you make an INT save to remove a stack.
If you can't keep up with the damage, you dial back the illithid power spam.
I tested it on an Eldritch Knight with 19 INT--no other bonuses, just +4 to INT saves--and I struggled to even get 3 stacks. The only way you're getting 3+ is if you're a) not built for it or b) not playing around it.
The only way you're getting 3+ is if you're a) not built for it or b) not playing around it.This is a problem. You shouldn't be forced to "build for it" or "play around it" to use what is supposed to be a prominent gameplay feature. You're locking the feature away from a decent chunk of players and then claiming you've made it "better". This isn't better, this is "play the game the way I am playing".P.S. 19 int is way, way higher than average. 19 anything is higher than normal. You shouldn't base your tests around someone with a nearly maxed stat.
If the mod is to remain in this state not only am I going to have to remove it, I certainly won't be recommending it to anyone.
Lvl 10 character with 8 int and 130 HP succes this check 0 times and just died.
If this effect were timed (like 10 turns, each stack +10 turns) or rebalanced to need CON saving throw, then everything would be good, but now it's just funny how unfunny this mechanic is. I will personally move to illithid powers overhaul after this playthrough
That said, either you were extremely unlucky or you're leaving out some vital information. Two stacks will take you to 6 INT for a -2 modifier to INT saves and do 7 Psychic damage per turn on average. The DC is 16, so you have to roll 18 or above. To go from 130 HP to 0 without passing a single save, you would have to fail 19 times in a row. To die, you would have to fail another three times in a row. The chances of that happening are 4.6% and 2.8%, respectively.
However, if you're using the Risky Ring, which gives Disadvantage on all saves, those probabilities shoot up to 64.9% and 60.6%.
Out of turn-based mode, each turn is six seconds, so you went AFK with an intentionally deadly debuff ticking for two minutes. I'm honestly not sure what you expected to happen.
This mechanic is not punishing at all; it just requires adjusting and actually considering.
I do not know what the people above are doing, but it seems like they use their powers on min(or close to min) INT characters wantonly with no abilities up to grant better saves and no gear related to it either... At which point, yeah. You are an idiot; you should get punished.
Do you have any suggestions other than just removing it? For instance, I could make it so stronger enemies (e.g., those with >= 100 HP, either max or current) or certain enemy types (e.g., undead and constructs) are immune.
just constructs or undead not enough i think, because of some strong beasts have also low int and ch stats, but limit for current hp sounds good (max its bad idea, because little enemies will dies by damage earlier, then its stat becomes 0, its funny for strong enemies, but its should be not so op), mb max 50 hp would be nice (100 its too much i think)
In Spell_Target.txt, delete
new entry "Target_TAD_BlackHole"
type "SpellData"
data "SpellType" "Target"
using "Target_TAD_BlackHole"
data "SpellProperties" "Force(-6,TargetToEntity,Neutral,false,true);GROUND:ApplyStatus(SELF,TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA,100,10)"
data "AreaRadius" "6"
data "Description" "h4a03134fgd645g4abagbc01g37e615a07bb7;1"
data "DescriptionParams" "10"
data "ExtraDescription" ""
data "TooltipStatusApply" "ApplyStatus(TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA,100,10)"
data "SpellFlags" "IsHarmful;DisableBlood;IsConcentration"
new entry "Target_TAD_BlackHole_Recast"
type "SpellData"
data "SpellType" "Target"
using "Target_TAD_BlackHole"
data "Cooldown" ""
data "SpellProperties" "Force(-6,TargetToEntity,Neutral,false,true)"
data "Description" "ha4249006g8b93g4925g9fb7g45d5d2b4ce5c;1"
data "TooltipStatusApply" ""
data "SpellFlags" "IsHarmful;DisableBlood;Temporary"
new entry "Target_MF_BlackHole"
type "SpellData"
data "SpellType" "Target"
using "Target_TAD_BlackHole_Recast"
data "Cooldown" "OncePerTurn"
data "SpellProperties" "Force(-6,TargetToEntity,false,true);DealDamage(3d4,Force,Magical)"
data "TooltipDamageList" "DealDamage(3d4,Force)"
data "SpellFlags" "IsHarmful;DisableBlood;Wildshape"
In Status_BOOST.txt, delete
new entry "MF_BLACK_HOLE_SLOW"type "StatusData"
data "StatusType" "BOOST"
using "MF_BLACK_HOLE_SLOW"
data "DescriptionParams" "DealDamage(3d4,Force)"
data "OnApplyFunctors" ""
and
new entry "TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA"type "StatusData"
data "StatusType" "BOOST"
using "TAD_BLACK_HOLE_AURA"
data "Description" "hb113a562g9443g4153ga7cfg2d0e813b8f35;1"
data "StatusPropertyFlags" ""
Additionally, can you make Perilous Stakes be able to cast on enemies in honour mode? Thanks anyway.
I'd like to use both of these amazing mods.
It doesn't change how you unlock powers, so it should be compatible with the mod you mentioned.
This one https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/2337
Presumably *not* compatible with Siael's Illithid Powers Overhaul... but I'm wondering if there other obvious/potential conflicts?
Testing now (on my idiosyncratic 900+ mod load order), but if ya got thoughts on such, shout.
Hadn't considered the "more lightweight option that tries to preserve the vanilla feel of the system" factor... which I kinda prefer, now that I think about it. I had run Siael's mod for a while until some messiness in re: the Patch 6 + Script Extender agida back circa February (along with various of Belinn's tadpole mods, and prolly some other things I'm forgetting), and so had dropped it from the load order since & have been looking for an alternative. Lightweight deltas that preserve the vanilla feel kinda hits the sweet spot imo. So, thx!
Wondering:
what happens if your Tav is already fully tadpoled when this mod is installed on an existing save?
Edit: I rereleased 1.0 with a fix. Hopefully that still shows up for the people who already downloaded it.
It works perfectly :-)