Interesting mod. I agree with the logic, as it is specifically stated by Tullius that there are indeed still Stormcloaks in the wilderness. Nice mod! Let's see what you come up with next.
The rebellion is older then Ulfric's leadership. He is just a charismatic leader, remove him and others will try to take over. The Stormcloaks are if anything an alliance of different rebellious groups. You cannot end the rebellion by removing Ulfric, only cripple them and in the long run he may actually receive martyr status this way. The Empire will only momentarily regain control but it will fade fast and then they will be locked into a quagmire of insurrection all over Skyrim. This may even spread to other provinces.
If anything the general populace will be content with a Imperial victory thanks to rising public safety + normalized merchant trade and label all remaining Storm-cloacks as bandits and raiders which they are.
Skyrim barely produces enough food supplies for it self so it needs trade. And those that they are able to produce are limited to leeks, cabbages, fish and mead while for almost everything else they need imports from Cyrodill.
How many actual storm-cloak sympathizers are in positions of economic and public influence for their actions and support to actually matter?
Vignar Graymane? Poor old fart sitting around in Jorvaskr complaining about how everything was better in the past and being jealous of the Battleborns because they got rich by supplying the Imperial army during the Great war.
The companions are a neutral party so nope no support for Storm-cloaks.
Skald the Elder? A loudmouth from his youth and even before the rebellion people relied more on a retired legionary to deal with their problems. Holds barely any influence among the common folk which mocks him openly.
With an Imperial victory he has no economic base to maintain support and people in Dawnstar are glad he's gone.
Layla Lawgiver? Has second thoughts about Ulfric and his thugs but is ignorant of everything else. At least she has one son with a good head on his shoulders and was smart enough not to kill him.
The Black-briar family already runs Riften and not a single commoner seems to know Layla even exists.
The Silver-blood family?
Tough luck getting those supplies and silver past the imperial garrison and Forsworn. Not to mention that the empire would gladly seize those silver mines if given the chance to do so and having evidence of the silverbloods supplying the Storm-cloaks would give them just that.
Dengeir of Stuhn? Largely mocked and shunned as paranoid old oaf (despite being right one some accounts). Also his whole family are descendants of a vampire lord.
Jarl Korir? Jarl of Winterhold? More like Jarl of one Inn and a Store. Openly antagonizes the College of Winterhold which is the only source of money there.
Who's going to support Ulfric or the Stormcloacks? An angry shop owner, one mill owner, two blacksmiths and three retired old men with no financial or social influence?
If not for Thalmor spies indirectly sending info to Ulfric about imperial movements that war would have been over in a matter of weeks if you look at this.
Also just one more thing. Ulfric used magic in a duel so any mention of him being honorable is pure BS. H e shows the traditional Nord attitude showed in all the games so far : ''Whine about honor all the time but cheat and plunder whenever you can.''
Hey, I really like your mod, well done! however there is a small problem, you see the legates are now both in the hold's capital and in the camp which doesn't make any sense ( being in two places at once ), they should be in one place preferably close to the jarl. So can the one's at the camp be deleted or replaced with new npcs?
1) You could put a condition on the Legates that stops them from spawning if the Imperials won the war. 2) Place a generic Legate at the camps and make them respawnable. You could make them sandbox and sleep. Just copy the original Legates AI packages. You could also make all the Imperials at the camps respawnable.
Interesting mod. I agree with the logic, as it is specifically stated by Tullius that there are indeed still Stormcloaks in the wilderness. Nice mod! Let's see what you come up with next.
this sounds great. but i'll wait until i complete the second great war mod before installing this, as i'd suspect it may cause issues if i did it in the middle or before it starts
Several questions: 1) what happens if we try to run the mod before the war is ended?
The civil war is grossly under-represented, and the civl war overhaul eats too many resources for my computer to run. OTOH, this looks ideal for having military camps in each of the holds for both sides, lore-splained as skirmishing with a fall-back position to rally to. Which is what happens realistically in civil wars; there are no exact borders - everyone just groups up with the closest allies to try and drive the other side out.
2 Can you run both the stormcloak and imperal versions at the same time?
3 is it possible to make the field commanders generic instead of specific?
I cant believe the chat on here ,,,scum imperials ohhh come on there piss weak """ hellll i barley make 100 septims out of a set of imperial armor ,,, ulfic is the mann . i wonder just how many people play the sides
I do like the notion of maintaining the camps after the defeat of Ulfric, especially given the fact the camps have quartermasters while the newly occupied fortresses do not seem to have any type of merchant.
I'm making the assumption the quartermasters for the camps return along with everyone else.
This is perfect. I can now check out how my Imperial riders and extra camp from my HOP mod works with these camps. I only have "Imperials won CW" saves. Thanks man.
Finally I can see how well I integrated my additions to the Imperial camps. Thanks again and endorsed.
I found that some of my Imperial Camp map markers were changed to not discovered yet. Also, some of the Imperials were dead and for some reason a couple of them ended up dead on top of the camp fires.
Pretty well all of them, I believe. Now this is on a save where the Imperials have won and the camps are gone. I fast travelled near each camp. There was no blood splatter near them, so I don't think they were killed during play. Could be a mod conflict, I will try to check in TES5Edit. I will upload some images for you.
[00:00] Checking for Errors in [8A] GusMod - ReEnable Imperial Camps.esp [00:00] zGusModEnableImperialCampReach [REFR:8A000D62] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C])) [00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Editor ID, Base [00:00] [REFR:8A000D64] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C])) [00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base [00:00] [REFR:8A000D65] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C])) [00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base [00:00] [REFR:8A000D66] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C])) [00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base [00:00] [REFR:8A000D67] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C])) [00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base [00:00] [REFR:8A000D68] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C])) [00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base [00:00] [REFR:8A000D69] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C])) [00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base [00:00] All Done!
The camps which are still shown as discovered have the dead Imperials, which seem to just drop from the air. The Quartermaster and Legate are fine. The camps which are shown as undiscovered are ok. Eastmarch camp had dead bodies, but the Reach camp was ok. I am uploading an image of the Eastmarch Imperial Camp.
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Skyrim barely produces enough food supplies for it self so it needs trade.
And those that they are able to produce are limited to leeks, cabbages, fish and mead while for almost everything else they need imports from Cyrodill.
How many actual storm-cloak sympathizers are in positions of economic and public influence for their actions and support to actually matter?
Vignar Graymane?
Poor old fart sitting around in Jorvaskr complaining about how everything was better in the past and being jealous of the Battleborns because they got rich by supplying the Imperial army during the Great war.
The companions are a neutral party so nope no support for Storm-cloaks.
Skald the Elder?
A loudmouth from his youth and even before the rebellion people relied more on a retired legionary to deal with their problems.
Holds barely any influence among the common folk which mocks him openly.
With an Imperial victory he has no economic base to maintain support and people in Dawnstar are glad he's gone.
Layla Lawgiver?
Has second thoughts about Ulfric and his thugs but is ignorant of everything else.
At least she has one son with a good head on his shoulders and was smart enough not to kill him.
The Black-briar family already runs Riften and not a single commoner seems to know Layla even exists.
The Silver-blood family?
Tough luck getting those supplies and silver past the imperial garrison and Forsworn.
Not to mention that the empire would gladly seize those silver mines if given the chance to do so and having evidence of the silverbloods supplying the Storm-cloaks would give them just that.
Dengeir of Stuhn?
Largely mocked and shunned as paranoid old oaf (despite being right one some accounts).
Also his whole family are descendants of a vampire lord.
Jarl Korir?
Jarl of Winterhold?
More like Jarl of one Inn and a Store.
Openly antagonizes the College of Winterhold which is the only source of money there.
Who's going to support Ulfric or the Stormcloacks?
An angry shop owner, one mill owner, two blacksmiths and three retired old men with no financial or social influence?
If not for Thalmor spies indirectly sending info to Ulfric about imperial movements that war would have been over in a matter of weeks if you look at this.
Also just one more thing.
Ulfric used magic in a duel so any mention of him being honorable is pure BS.
H
e shows the traditional Nord attitude showed in all the games so far : ''Whine about honor all the time but cheat and plunder whenever you can.''
1) You could put a condition on the Legates that stops them from spawning if the Imperials won the war.
2) Place a generic Legate at the camps and make them respawnable. You could make them sandbox and sleep. Just copy the original Legates AI packages. You could also make all the Imperials at the camps respawnable.
1) what happens if we try to run the mod before the war is ended?
The civil war is grossly under-represented, and the civl war overhaul eats too many resources for my computer to run. OTOH, this looks ideal for having military camps in each of the holds for both sides, lore-splained as skirmishing with a fall-back position to rally to. Which is what happens realistically in civil wars; there are no exact borders - everyone just groups up with the closest allies to try and drive the other side out.
2 Can you run both the stormcloak and imperal versions at the same time?
3 is it possible to make the field commanders generic instead of specific?
,,, ulfic is the mann . i wonder just how many people play the sides
I'm making the assumption the quartermasters for the camps return along with everyone else.
I found that some of my Imperial Camp map markers were changed to not discovered yet. Also, some of the Imperials were dead and for some reason a couple of them ended up dead on top of the camp fires.
[00:00] Checking for Errors in [8A] GusMod - ReEnable Imperial Camps.esp
[00:00] zGusModEnableImperialCampReach [REFR:8A000D62] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C]))
[00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Editor ID, Base
[00:00] [REFR:8A000D64] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C]))
[00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base
[00:00] [REFR:8A000D65] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C]))
[00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base
[00:00] [REFR:8A000D66] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C]))
[00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base
[00:00] [REFR:8A000D67] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C]))
[00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base
[00:00] [REFR:8A000D68] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C]))
[00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base
[00:00] [REFR:8A000D69] (places XMarker [STAT:0000003B] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of [CELL:00000D74] (in Tamriel "Skyrim" [WRLD:0000003C]))
[00:00] REFR -> Record marked as deleted but contains: Base
[00:00] All Done!
The camps which are still shown as discovered have the dead Imperials, which seem to just drop from the air. The Quartermaster and Legate are fine. The camps which are shown as undiscovered are ok. Eastmarch camp had dead bodies, but the Reach camp was ok. I am uploading an image of the Eastmarch Imperial Camp.