I played to like september on classic then switched tk brutal, which was quite a significant jump from classic.
I base my opinion/guide based on brutal difficulty. My current setup is something like 50% OW Inf, 20% Mayhem Sniper (with a couple DT sniper), 20% Medic (60/40 or so mix on OW/Hard Support), 10% CCS Assault
I am in December and I think I am going to win, but I feel like it's only because of OW infantry spam.
S Tier Class:
Infantry I feel like nothing is more effective than Overwatch infantry. Not just between Infantry specializations, but out of all classes in the mod. a. Sentinel is insanely strong since it gives opportunist for free, also having access to LnL and Snapshot makes Infantry braindead to use in firefights b. Overwatch reduces enemy cover evasion and DR by a lot, making it deal way more effective damage than conventional shooting c. Overwatch can fire up to 4 shots with Snapshot and Genetics or Psionics on Infantry, 3 without. Firing conventionally twice with only allows two shots. d. Infantry stat growth is the best, and has high will for Psionics
There is really no reason to shoot conventionally on infantry which I feel like shouldve been the playstyle of infantry. Instead just reloading and overwatching every time is by far more effective. Grenadier Infantry feels unviable because cover is so tanky and the grenade range is very short in this mod.
A Tier Class:
Sniper I think Snipers (Mayhem) are nicely balanced and useful in their niche, and weak in other situations like inside UFOs.
DT build is also pretty good, but less reliable to use. I go mostly Mayhem on brutal difficulty where enemies have high hp. It has the upside of being able to move + shoot + shoot in a single turn which can be pretty sick, but I think that playstyle maybe fits something like the scout better.
ITZ Snipers are far too hard to use imo, unless you cheese the game with stealth or hide outside pod range + battle scanner to set it up. 3 Shots with the other two not even being steadied is not enough compensation for being unable to shoot on contact. For example, if you had 3 enemies pop up, a mayhem sniper could immediately take one out, then take out another next turn. ITZ sniper kills 0 on turn of contact, meaning more enemies attacking you, and then kill maybe 3 but typically only 2 kills on 2nd turn. Which Mayhem Sniper would have also done. I think ITZ sniper needs more compensation, for example make the other two shots also count as steadied, or add bullseye to allow for Bullseye+ITZ (I think this would only work on strike rifles, which would be a big damage drop to balance this sick combo out)
Assault I think this class is well balanced. Similar to sniper, they dominate their role of CQC. Though it's kind of weird that assault has less mobility than infantry.
Medic It's a support class, so I don't have much opinions about it as I don't pay attention to it as much. But I do recognize that it is strong. I usually go overwatch medic, but I also have some full support medics. Only thing is Combat Drugs are much worse than Dense Smoke, but probably this is balanced because medic class is overall better than engineer.
Other Classes (I didn't use much):
Scout Bullseye + VPT Scout feels ok. Worse dps than snipers but has some support/utility effects.
Overall I don't use scouts much and i'd rather put my detection on a shiv. The full support scout build feels quite bad. Smoke competes with Bullseye which is in my opinion essential. HnR feels too restrictive for the core ability.
I suggest moving the DT build from sniper to scout as an alternate playstyle, and maybe buff scout skill combinations a bit like allowing bullseye+HnR.
Gunner I don't really use gunner much, I tried making a couple and they feel like they could be strong, but it requires to play the game around them due to being highly immobile and need to give up tankyness for accuracy/damage. I think their stat growth is a bit too shitty (compared to infantry which is what I see them as competing with) when they are so stat reliant.
Rocketeer I have no clue what to do with this class... Having to wait 3 turns between rockets is just a huge nerf compared to regular LW. Their shooting build is OK, but with not as much weapon perks as other shooter classes, I don't really care about shooting for 1-2 dmg after DR, especially if it risks overwatch fire.
I see they have a breaching/cover destroying grenade build too, but cover overall feels too tanky for that strategy to work well compared to just spamming overwatch infantry.
Engineer They are required for mech repair. I tried them out and mecs in my classic run, but I needed to go pure bio with overwatch infantry spam to play brutal so I don't use them.
What I do is always play with randomized skill trees. Some skills don't seem to be randomized, but power builds don't seem to be that common this way. Now I play also with hidden skill trees, which reduces the overall power level even further.
Infantry:
I completely agree. Sentinel is crazy strong. The whole gameplay often feels way too overwatch centric, since overwatching is in most cases purely better than shooting. Things are a little bit better now that steadying a weapon is more powerful. But still, enemies like overwatching way too much, and one new "fun" addition apparently was to give drones sentinel as well. The overwatch creep gameplay of vanilla/Long War was fixed, but this mod has it's own flavour of overwatch creep.
Sniper:
In the zone used to be that you could shoot until out of ammo. Combined with Bullseye (steadying costs only 1 AP) it was very good. Now not so great, though the shoot-to-reload is nice. Now I only seem to want to make mayhem snipers. But I also pretty much only use strike rifles, so I don't really use real snipers at all.
Assault:
Agree. Assault has seen many variations as well. The current one is not my favourite. There was something about the old Close Combat Specialist that simply felt so badass. It was probably way too powerful, I agree, especially since it was a sort of a force multiplier. With a squad of assaults, you just ran over the map and everyone died. Sort of. But, the Pistolero is simply lame in comparison. Still, the reaction immunity within 4 tiles is plenty worth it.
Scout:
I really like the detection of the Scout. I find it especially nice to know what's coming. Otherwise with randomized trees the scouts are sort of all over the place. I think with fixed trees you get Smoke and Mirrors and Concealment, which are very good. Though, now that anyone can throw a smoke without triggering overwatch, it lost a bit of luster. Still, I always found that a squad loaded with smoke is very powerful, which I'm perhaps struggling the most with randomized trees.
Gunner:
I don't think you use gunners for accuracy. You use them to deal guaranteed damage with LMGs and use burst for accuracy. That's what all of my gunners do anyway. Though, that also seems to have seen a weakening effect since I last played. But somewhere in the mid game with shredder and armor piercing ammo with gauss weapons, the gunner is very strong. And late game with the plasma LMG + other armor piercing sources.
Rocketeer:
There's a trend here. Rocketeer USED to be pretty good as well. You used to get two rockets with your launcher and could equip an additional rocket as well, and the cooldown was shorter. Today's one rocket + shredder is just sad in comparison. You pretty much have to wait until you get the blaster launcher. The blaster launcher, though with shorter range, has auto-guided rockets. So you can shoot from anywhere. Of course, getting one is not cheap, and now that apparently the number of fusion cores has also gone down...
Engineer:
No idea... There used to be a good build with double tap + breaching ammo which destroyed mechanical units with shotguns. I don't think it's valid anymore though. I don't find mechanical units very useful, apart from punching marauders, since late-game enemies pretty much all have armor piercing, critical system or some other stuff that annihilates them in one turn. Or in one hit, in case of leader cyberdiscs or something.
I think many powerful combos have been smoothed out. There is less bullshit in the mod nowadays as well, though. Mechanical units aren't acided for the rest of the mission anymore, which used to make them completely pointless. You don't get 10 thin men dropping down on overwatch in council missions and so on. However, the less bullshit doesn't really affect the final mission, so unless you've looked up what it's about, you're just not going to win. I have played the mod on impossible in the past, but I don't believe I will ever actually win the mod. The final mission is simply something beyond my ability.
So I've got a weird bug and I want to know if this is a cosmetic problem or a substantive one. Several of the abilities in my soldier's tech trees are mislabeled - they have the right icon as displayed on the Long War Rebalanced wiki here:https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Gunner_(LWR) but say something absolutely different. See: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2876456553
Are the skill descriptions hard coded and the skills actually do what they say on the wiki, or can I make regen field gunners?!? Because there are a number of things like this in my soldier trees.
I'm running Long War Mod Manager to use VR Training (LW), Enhanced Tactical Info (LW), and Commander's Choice Squaddie Assignments. I suspect the last one is the culprit.
I'll give the scratch refresh a shot and keep the first two mods, unless you know they don't work with LW-Rebalanced.
EDIT - ok my bad, on reinstall rereading the instructions I see your very clear instructions NOT to use the LW Mod Manager like I did. My bad,
Is Mobility capped in 10? I change items on loadout screen, and mobility doesn't raide above 10, but when I equip too many -mobility items, it can be lower, like 10-0,6.
No, but there is a visual display bug where it doesn't show correctly in soldier load out - Just ignore it and know it works in game. Or just reload the game and that usually fixes it.
Question about Overwatch with Sniper: I've tried ITZ build but I found it useless. 30+ misson and I used ITZ only 3-4 times. DT build is not bad, since it can do 3 shots in 3 rounds, 4-5 shots in 4 rounds depending on clip size. So basically it moves your shots to 1st and 3rdd round which is better then shoot once/turn. Now I am trying Mayhem+Opportunist build, but my sniper didn't shoot during Overwatch. 6 enemies were in line of sight, all distances were between 20 and 28 tiiles. Should OV work with Squadsight, or shouldn't? If this is intended and OV doesn't work with Squadsight, maybe I retalent and skip Opportunist.
The description of squadsight in the game and on the wiki:
Squadsight Allows firing around some obstacles and beyond 18 tiles at targets with a spotter (an unconcealed ally at 0 AP that can see the target) with -3 aim for each tile further than 18. Does not apply to overwatch or reaction shots. Grants Low Profile
Casual player here. How do you deal with Mind Controlling Sectoid Commanders? Usually I run forward and gun them down with everything I got while restraining my controlled soldier with flashbangs/suppressive fire, but it's becoming kinda hard to do (and I'm yet to see Ethereals in the field so s#*!'s gonna get even worse).
I just encountered boss sectoid commander, he MC'ed my soldier who flanks my whole squad, I can't get closer to him because he stays back and moving forward would open both of my flanks. And the little bugger has some sort of psi shield on him so everything I shoot at him does minimal 1 hp damage.
So MC can be broken with explosives or concussion grenades.
A support rocketeer is probably your strongest bet at stop MC. They can get the neural damepning gene mod, the dual heart throw range gene mod and bombard. This lets them rocket and/or throw concussion grenades to break MC fairly quickly.
Also the MC'd soldier only has 1 AP each turn so they are usually easy to ignore.
Thanks for a reply. Yeah, I have no experienced support rocketeers currently, seems to be my bad.
As I predicted, fraking Ethereals f*#@ me up. I'm trying to attack alien base. These Ethereals spawns in pairs (one purple, one regular) plus somewhere in fog of war there is a sectopod behind. So these guys MC two of my front line troopers and Sectopod bombards all cover for middle line to smithereens. And backline can't even get a clear shot into ethereals as front line is MC'ed and middle line is too busy retreating into cover to be spotters. Add to that a veritable swarm of regular aliens and the fact that Ethereal kicks harder that plasma cannon (psi mastery + 2 mind frays per turn = 16 psi-damage on my MEC tank before he got MCed).
I got 7 titan-clad augmented Master sergeants lugging plasma guns and a MEC in UltraHeavy Mk3 suit and I keep getting KIAs here even after restarting numerous times to get a better positioning. I have to face the possibility that I just suck.
Yeah, I should experiment with SHIVs, I think. My only hover SHIV got destroyed previous mission, when I intentionally sacrificed a machine to save my Master sergeant. Guess hover SHIVs cannot tank, they're more like fragile flankers? Also, if I remember correctly, SHIVs get extra damage from psi attacks like Mind Fray and Rifts due to no will stat for a save throw?
And regarding Neural dampening - it's not available for everyone? I bought it for some, but others do not have that option. I guess it's unavailable for Psi soldiers, I play with second wave that allows combining Psi and Genmods.
So, partway through my first Impossible campaign (with save-scumming) and here's my thoughts on soldier builds:
Assault: This is a class that, from the get go, is designed for the Shotgun. While you can get some profit out of using SMGs as well, I stuck with using a shotgun for the accuracy boost and high base damage. WtS is essential, any other pick leaves your early Assault too fragile. My early shotgun assault build is WtS - Exrta Con/Tenacious D. Further builds are either Ranger/Brawler for flexibility or KI/Aggression to go all-in on that shotgun damage.
Infantry: Infantry are my chosen psions because of their high will boost. As for perks, Sentinel is a no-brainer because of how powerful Overwatch is. I experimented with Grenadier, but without Sapper it's never going to be as good as on an Engineer. My Infantry build is Sentinel - LnL - ExCon - Ranger - CritSys - Aggression.
Sniper: Mayhem/SS/Opportunist or ITZ/SS/Executioner are both very viable builds. Give a hi-cap to the ITZ so he can simply reload by taking a shot after an ITZ chain. Later on, Disabling Shot simply isn't as good because your Sniper is often your only reliable damage against high-defense enemies, so you need either BEO or VPT. If you want Disabling, toss someone an Arc Rifle.
Scout: I've experimented with both Bull's Eye scouts with a marksman scope and Support scouts with an SMG, and have had fun with both. With Bull's Eye, Disabling Shot suddenly becomes a very viable choice. But having an extra support grenadier works great for dealing with multiple active pods.
Gunner: Even though there are times I've missed not taking Mayhem, in the end I prefer WtS because like Assaults, Gunners get shot at a lot. Sentinel is not a choice because of crap aim from both poor progression and the LMG I prefer. The two perks I consider essential for a gunner are Holo and LnL, and I prefer to give them an LMG with a hi-cap.
Engineer: Got hit with a huge nerf bat, earlier an Engi could do both cover destruction and support grenades, now you have to pick one. Since other classes can do support, it's explosive Engis all the way... except you don't get reliable cover destruction until late which is frustrating. I look forward to when all my Engis have Sapper.
Medic: Smoke and Mirrors - ExCon - Combat Drugs - Shadowstep - Packmaster. I consider this the essential Medic build, there are plenty of other classes if you want to Overwatch or shoot stuff. Medics are also my preferred Covert Op units, since that means I don't need to bring a team medic.
Rocketeers: This class was the hardest to adapt to from old LW. From being a premier anti-armor unit, Rocketeers have become a support tool to clear mass enemy overwatch. I give them S&M and Holo to give them some utility outside of the rockets. I still consider them an important class because of how they can disrupt overwatch-campers and damage flyers, but they are no longer a must-have.
Hello. Can you tell me how calculated total DR%? For example. Soldier in full cover (50%). Will to survive - 40% Psi defender - 40% Inner fire - 10-15% Plus Damage control, Grit, Dense smoke, officer's ability and maybe something else.
How is it all calculated? Does DR% have a cap? Is it necessary to make biotank a psionic or is it enough? Maybe something not to take from this. To know which build is optimal for me. Answer please.
Hi, these are my thoughts on the soldier builds for LWR 1.36.07:
Infantry: WtS - Dind't use. Seems not quite as necessary to me at least compared to other classes that can be bio tanks. An infantry biotank doesn't bring anything special to the table imo. Sentinel - Did use. Much weaker as it used to be. Overwatch does not work on enemies which are not in LOS and thinmen ignore overwatch with snapshot. I stopped making overwatch builds. Grenadier - Did use. Jack of all trades, master of none, but still my preferred infantry build. Grenades are limited in their use but they are very necessary. Just think of chryssalids or the massive Muton DR when in full cover. Infantry can shoot twice when the enemy is out of grenade range and I think that the other infantry builds are week, so I tend to put my infantry on grenade duty.
Gunner: WtS - Did use. Probably the strongest gunner build right now. Tankiest bio tank if Grit is taken, but this comes at the cost of CST though. Sentinel - Did use. Same as with infantry. Overwatch classes have suffered. I stopped making them. Mayhem - Did use. The bullet wizard lost the ability to suppress two turns in a row which was quite a huge blow to this build. It didn't reach the full potential of this build yet (predictive tracking), but so far it felt weak to me.
Sniper: ITZ - Did use. Requires a lot of setup. Steading in the beginning of a fight instead of taking a shot results in more damage taken. In 2 out 3 turns he doesn't offer any contribution to the damage of the team. In 1 out of 3 turns he deals all his damage and needs to be set up properly for this particular turn and the alien sometimes mess up your setup with their positioning. This build is definitely much weaker than it used to be. I stopped making ITZ snipers. Mayhem - Did use. Probably the strongest sniper build right now since ITZ is in a bad spot imo. Works with both sniper rifle and strike rifle giving you the option the be more mobile if necessary. The overall damage is comparable to ITZ I think, but this damage is not delayed which will make your tank live longer. DT - Didn't use. The overall damage and the ammo consumption feels weak to me. I guess DT could be OK for flanking with a strike rifle though. Also there is the option for DT holo similar to what engineers are able to do. This is basically more of a support build for snipers. But unlike engineers the "support sniper" will not be able to heal your SHIV.
Scout: Smoke and Mirrors - Did use. Support grenades are mandatory. Think of thinmen dropping in with active overwatch. Think of the mobility of chryssalids. But is the Scout the best option for it? I don't think so. He tends up to end up too far away for good use of flashbangs in my games. Snapshot - Did use. Probably the strongest Scout build right now if luck is on your side, but luck can let you down of course. My snapshot scouts were stronger than my ITZ snipers so far but mainly because ITZ is in a bad spot right now. H&R: Didn't use. Probably best for flanking. But I don't feel like this will help much in big fights in the mid or late game.
Medic: WtS - Didn't use. The big plus is that he can heal himself and keep on pushing after taking some damage. Having the tank and the healer in one soldier means that you can bring an additional damage dealer with you. But the medic is not as tanky as the other bio tanks and he can be taken out by crits easily if you're unlucky. I think he should be really good with a shotgun on exalt missions. But I wouldn't value him much on other missions. Sentinel - Did use. Same as with Infantry and gunners. I stopped making overwatch builds. Smoke and Mirrors - Did use. Someone has to bring support grenades and imo the medic is the best for that. He tends up to be in the middle of the team and can make good use of both flashbangs and smoke grenades. I always use a medkit in the first gear slot. So there are only 2 slots available for support grenades unfortunately.
Assault: R&G - Did use. Glass canon. Super good in some situations, terrible in others. I like bringing them to missions that have a low number of enemies. That speeds up the fights without too much risks. Grenadier - Did use. Grenading while trying to get into CE range does work to some extend, but such Assaults tend to get wounded or killed. They can't choose their positions quite as well as R&G Assaults and they don't have the tankiness of WtS Assaults. WtS - Did use. This is the more aggressive tank option. Assaults work best when they can get close to the enemy. Making them tanky does reduce the risks involved with closing the distance. I leave a radom "CLOSE RANGE?" meme here. :)
Engineer: Grenadier - Didn't use. Technically the best class to remove short range cover or chryssalids. But it's kind of a one trick pony. Might make one for terror missions at some point. Smoke and Mirrors - Didn't use. This build works very similar to the support medic with the benefit of holo rounds and one more slot available for support grenades (since my engineers don't carry medkits) at the cost of Shadowstep. But I prefer having only one support grenadier in my team and I went for medic support grenadier because I don't like the other medic builds currently. DT - Did use. Double holo (as long DT is not on CD) is helpful. Holo is mandatory since some enemies are really hard to hit. I like putting my engineers on holo duty.
Rocketeer: LEU - Did use. The most versatile Rocketeer build. I value the combination of LEU and Holo Rounds. It helps the team while the rocket is on CD. Smoke and Mirrors - Did not use. As described before I felt Medics are best suited for Support grenades because of the lack of other good builds. As for support Rocketeers: Once they run out rockets and support grenades they become useless. May be good for shorter missions, but definitely not good for long missions. Sometimes I would like to use both a rocket and support grenades in the same turn. With the rocketeer you basically have to decide which one to use in a given turn. Grenadier - Did not use. They should be awesome for terror missions in theory. Rocket the floaters, grenade the chryssalids. But as described before I think infantry is best on grenade duty because of the lack of other good infantry builds. Also you have only 2 slots remaining for grenades if you put a rocket into the first slot.
Summary of my "go to" builds for general use and their roles in the team right now: - Grenadier Infantry => Grenade duty, LEU otherwise - WtS Gunner => Tanking duty, suppress - WtS Assault => Tanking duty, good against close ranged / not hardened enemies (hi EXALT) - Mayhem Sniper => Take out or injure dangerous targets - Snapshot Scout => Scouting duty, good against seekers, execute low HP targets - Smoke and Mirrors Medic => Heal bio tanks, good against overwatch spam - DT Engineer => Heal SHIV, holo duty - LEU Rocketeer => Rockets in case of emergency, holo duty otherwise
Hi all, hope we are all good, and sticking it to the filthy alien scum :-) I have a question that I've never been able to satisfactorily answer - I always feel I could have done better: How do people decide who to GM and who to Officer? Psi and MEC are relatively simple to select, but I'm never really sure that I have left the right units GM-free to upgrade to Officers (or promoted the ones that should've been modified). Any thoughts? Cheers!
I think it really depends on the type of units you build. For example, an OW user gene mods are especially good for. Are you grabbing Muton Interrogation? If you are, supports really benefit from gene mods. Officers are generally great all around so they can fit in wherever.
I think the best bet is to find how you really want gene mods on, who you really want psi on, then focus on the officer after.
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LW Rebalance Builds and Strategies (876 comments)
I base my opinion/guide based on brutal difficulty. My current setup is something like 50% OW Inf, 20% Mayhem Sniper (with a couple DT sniper), 20% Medic (60/40 or so mix on OW/Hard Support), 10% CCS Assault
I am in December and I think I am going to win, but I feel like it's only because of OW infantry spam.
S Tier Class:
Infantry
I feel like nothing is more effective than Overwatch infantry. Not just between Infantry specializations, but out of all classes in the mod.
a. Sentinel is insanely strong since it gives opportunist for free, also having access to LnL and Snapshot makes Infantry braindead to use in firefights
b. Overwatch reduces enemy cover evasion and DR by a lot, making it deal way more effective damage than conventional shooting
c. Overwatch can fire up to 4 shots with Snapshot and Genetics or Psionics on Infantry, 3 without. Firing conventionally twice with only allows two shots.
d. Infantry stat growth is the best, and has high will for Psionics
There is really no reason to shoot conventionally on infantry which I feel like shouldve been the playstyle of infantry. Instead just reloading and overwatching every time is by far more effective.
Grenadier Infantry feels unviable because cover is so tanky and the grenade range is very short in this mod.
A Tier Class:
Sniper
I think Snipers (Mayhem) are nicely balanced and useful in their niche, and weak in other situations like inside UFOs.
DT build is also pretty good, but less reliable to use. I go mostly Mayhem on brutal difficulty where enemies have high hp.
It has the upside of being able to move + shoot + shoot in a single turn which can be pretty sick, but I think that playstyle maybe fits something like the scout better.
ITZ Snipers are far too hard to use imo, unless you cheese the game with stealth or hide outside pod range + battle scanner to set it up. 3 Shots with the other two not even being steadied is not enough compensation for being unable to shoot on contact.
For example, if you had 3 enemies pop up, a mayhem sniper could immediately take one out, then take out another next turn. ITZ sniper kills 0 on turn of contact, meaning more enemies attacking you, and then kill maybe 3 but typically only 2 kills on 2nd turn. Which Mayhem Sniper would have also done.
I think ITZ sniper needs more compensation, for example make the other two shots also count as steadied, or add bullseye to allow for Bullseye+ITZ (I think this would only work on strike rifles, which would be a big damage drop to balance this sick combo out)
Assault
I think this class is well balanced. Similar to sniper, they dominate their role of CQC.
Though it's kind of weird that assault has less mobility than infantry.
Medic
It's a support class, so I don't have much opinions about it as I don't pay attention to it as much. But I do recognize that it is strong.
I usually go overwatch medic, but I also have some full support medics. Only thing is Combat Drugs are much worse than Dense Smoke, but probably this is balanced because medic class is overall better than engineer.
Other Classes (I didn't use much):
Scout
Bullseye + VPT Scout feels ok. Worse dps than snipers but has some support/utility effects.
Overall I don't use scouts much and i'd rather put my detection on a shiv. The full support scout build feels quite bad. Smoke competes with Bullseye which is in my opinion essential. HnR feels too restrictive for the core ability.
I suggest moving the DT build from sniper to scout as an alternate playstyle, and maybe buff scout skill combinations a bit like allowing bullseye+HnR.
Gunner
I don't really use gunner much, I tried making a couple and they feel like they could be strong, but it requires to play the game around them due to being highly immobile and need to give up tankyness for accuracy/damage. I think their stat growth is a bit too shitty (compared to infantry which is what I see them as competing with) when they are so stat reliant.
Rocketeer
I have no clue what to do with this class... Having to wait 3 turns between rockets is just a huge nerf compared to regular LW. Their shooting build is OK, but with not as much weapon perks as other shooter classes, I don't really care about shooting for 1-2 dmg after DR, especially if it risks overwatch fire.
I see they have a breaching/cover destroying grenade build too, but cover overall feels too tanky for that strategy to work well compared to just spamming overwatch infantry.
Engineer
They are required for mech repair. I tried them out and mecs in my classic run, but I needed to go pure bio with overwatch infantry spam to play brutal so I don't use them.
Infantry:
I completely agree. Sentinel is crazy strong. The whole gameplay often feels way too overwatch centric, since overwatching is in most cases purely better than shooting. Things are a little bit better now that steadying a weapon is more powerful. But still, enemies like overwatching way too much, and one new "fun" addition apparently was to give drones sentinel as well. The overwatch creep gameplay of vanilla/Long War was fixed, but this mod has it's own flavour of overwatch creep.
Sniper:
In the zone used to be that you could shoot until out of ammo. Combined with Bullseye (steadying costs only 1 AP) it was very good. Now not so great, though the shoot-to-reload is nice. Now I only seem to want to make mayhem snipers. But I also pretty much only use strike rifles, so I don't really use real snipers at all.
Assault:
Agree. Assault has seen many variations as well. The current one is not my favourite. There was something about the old Close Combat Specialist that simply felt so badass. It was probably way too powerful, I agree, especially since it was a sort of a force multiplier. With a squad of assaults, you just ran over the map and everyone died. Sort of. But, the Pistolero is simply lame in comparison. Still, the reaction immunity within 4 tiles is plenty worth it.
Scout:
I really like the detection of the Scout. I find it especially nice to know what's coming. Otherwise with randomized trees the scouts are sort of all over the place. I think with fixed trees you get Smoke and Mirrors and Concealment, which are very good. Though, now that anyone can throw a smoke without triggering overwatch, it lost a bit of luster. Still, I always found that a squad loaded with smoke is very powerful, which I'm perhaps struggling the most with randomized trees.
Gunner:
I don't think you use gunners for accuracy. You use them to deal guaranteed damage with LMGs and use burst for accuracy. That's what all of my gunners do anyway. Though, that also seems to have seen a weakening effect since I last played. But somewhere in the mid game with shredder and armor piercing ammo with gauss weapons, the gunner is very strong. And late game with the plasma LMG + other armor piercing sources.
Rocketeer:
There's a trend here. Rocketeer USED to be pretty good as well. You used to get two rockets with your launcher and could equip an additional rocket as well, and the cooldown was shorter. Today's one rocket + shredder is just sad in comparison. You pretty much have to wait until you get the blaster launcher. The blaster launcher, though with shorter range, has auto-guided rockets. So you can shoot from anywhere. Of course, getting one is not cheap, and now that apparently the number of fusion cores has also gone down...
Engineer:
No idea... There used to be a good build with double tap + breaching ammo which destroyed mechanical units with shotguns. I don't think it's valid anymore though. I don't find mechanical units very useful, apart from punching marauders, since late-game enemies pretty much all have armor piercing, critical system or some other stuff that annihilates them in one turn. Or in one hit, in case of leader cyberdiscs or something.
I think many powerful combos have been smoothed out. There is less bullshit in the mod nowadays as well, though. Mechanical units aren't acided for the rest of the mission anymore, which used to make them completely pointless. You don't get 10 thin men dropping down on overwatch in council missions and so on. However, the less bullshit doesn't really affect the final mission, so unless you've looked up what it's about, you're just not going to win. I have played the mod on impossible in the past, but I don't believe I will ever actually win the mod. The final mission is simply something beyond my ability.
Are the skill descriptions hard coded and the skills actually do what they say on the wiki, or can I make regen field gunners?!? Because there are a number of things like this in my soldier trees.
Anyone know what's up here?
I'll give the scratch refresh a shot and keep the first two mods, unless you know they don't work with LW-Rebalanced.
EDIT - ok my bad, on reinstall rereading the instructions I see your very clear instructions NOT to use the LW Mod Manager like I did. My bad,
I've tried ITZ build but I found it useless. 30+ misson and I used ITZ only 3-4 times. DT build is not bad, since it can do 3 shots in 3 rounds, 4-5 shots in 4 rounds depending on clip size. So basically it moves your shots to 1st and 3rdd round which is better then shoot once/turn.
Now I am trying Mayhem+Opportunist build, but my sniper didn't shoot during Overwatch. 6 enemies were in line of sight, all distances were between 20 and 28 tiiles. Should OV work with Squadsight, or shouldn't? If this is intended and OV doesn't work with Squadsight, maybe I retalent and skip Opportunist.
Squadsight
Allows firing around some obstacles and beyond 18 tiles at targets with a spotter (an unconcealed ally at 0 AP that can see the target) with -3 aim for each tile further than 18. Does not apply to overwatch or reaction shots. Grants Low Profile
How do you deal with Mind Controlling Sectoid Commanders?
Usually I run forward and gun them down with everything I got while restraining my controlled soldier with flashbangs/suppressive fire, but it's becoming kinda hard to do (and I'm yet to see Ethereals in the field so s#*!'s gonna get even worse).
I just encountered boss sectoid commander, he MC'ed my soldier who flanks my whole squad, I can't get closer to him because he stays back and moving forward would open both of my flanks. And the little bugger has some sort of psi shield on him so everything I shoot at him does minimal 1 hp damage.
A support rocketeer is probably your strongest bet at stop MC. They can get the neural damepning gene mod, the dual heart throw range gene mod and bombard. This lets them rocket and/or throw concussion grenades to break MC fairly quickly.
Also the MC'd soldier only has 1 AP each turn so they are usually easy to ignore.
But yea, it can be really tricky.
As I predicted, fraking Ethereals f*#@ me up.
I'm trying to attack alien base. These Ethereals spawns in pairs (one purple, one regular) plus somewhere in fog of war there is a sectopod behind.
So these guys MC two of my front line troopers and Sectopod bombards all cover for middle line to smithereens. And backline can't even get a clear shot into ethereals as front line is MC'ed and middle line is too busy retreating into cover to be spotters.
Add to that a veritable swarm of regular aliens and the fact that Ethereal kicks harder that plasma cannon (psi mastery + 2 mind frays per turn = 16 psi-damage on my MEC tank before he got MCed).
I got 7 titan-clad augmented Master sergeants lugging plasma guns and a MEC in UltraHeavy Mk3 suit and I keep getting KIAs here even after restarting numerous times to get a better positioning. I have to face the possibility that I just suck.
Also, if I remember correctly, SHIVs get extra damage from psi attacks like Mind Fray and Rifts due to no will stat for a save throw?
And regarding Neural dampening - it's not available for everyone? I bought it for some, but others do not have that option.
I guess it's unavailable for Psi soldiers, I play with second wave that allows combining Psi and Genmods.
Assault:
This is a class that, from the get go, is designed for the Shotgun. While you can get some profit out of using SMGs as well, I stuck with using a shotgun for the accuracy boost and high base damage. WtS is essential, any other pick leaves your early Assault too fragile. My early shotgun assault build is WtS - Exrta Con/Tenacious D. Further builds are either Ranger/Brawler for flexibility or KI/Aggression to go all-in on that shotgun damage.
Infantry:
Infantry are my chosen psions because of their high will boost. As for perks, Sentinel is a no-brainer because of how powerful Overwatch is. I experimented with Grenadier, but without Sapper it's never going to be as good as on an Engineer. My Infantry build is Sentinel - LnL - ExCon - Ranger - CritSys - Aggression.
Sniper:
Mayhem/SS/Opportunist or ITZ/SS/Executioner are both very viable builds. Give a hi-cap to the ITZ so he can simply reload by taking a shot after an ITZ chain. Later on, Disabling Shot simply isn't as good because your Sniper is often your only reliable damage against high-defense enemies, so you need either BEO or VPT. If you want Disabling, toss someone an Arc Rifle.
Scout:
I've experimented with both Bull's Eye scouts with a marksman scope and Support scouts with an SMG, and have had fun with both. With Bull's Eye, Disabling Shot suddenly becomes a very viable choice. But having an extra support grenadier works great for dealing with multiple active pods.
Gunner:
Even though there are times I've missed not taking Mayhem, in the end I prefer WtS because like Assaults, Gunners get shot at a lot. Sentinel is not a choice because of crap aim from both poor progression and the LMG I prefer. The two perks I consider essential for a gunner are Holo and LnL, and I prefer to give them an LMG with a hi-cap.
Engineer:
Got hit with a huge nerf bat, earlier an Engi could do both cover destruction and support grenades, now you have to pick one. Since other classes can do support, it's explosive Engis all the way... except you don't get reliable cover destruction until late which is frustrating. I look forward to when all my Engis have Sapper.
Medic:
Smoke and Mirrors - ExCon - Combat Drugs - Shadowstep - Packmaster. I consider this the essential Medic build, there are plenty of other classes if you want to Overwatch or shoot stuff. Medics are also my preferred Covert Op units, since that means I don't need to bring a team medic.
Rocketeers:
This class was the hardest to adapt to from old LW. From being a premier anti-armor unit, Rocketeers have become a support tool to clear mass enemy overwatch. I give them S&M and Holo to give them some utility outside of the rockets. I still consider them an important class because of how they can disrupt overwatch-campers and damage flyers, but they are no longer a must-have.
For example. Soldier in full cover (50%).
Will to survive - 40%
Psi defender - 40%
Inner fire - 10-15%
Plus Damage control, Grit, Dense smoke, officer's ability and maybe something else.
How is it all calculated? Does DR% have a cap? Is it necessary to make biotank a psionic or is it enough? Maybe something not to take from this. To know which build is optimal for me. Answer please.
Total_DR = 1 - [(1 - DR) * (1 - DR) * (1 - DR) * (1 - DR) * etc. etc.]
Example of 30% DR and 50% DR and 20% DR:
Total_DR = 1 - [(1 - 0.3) * (1 - 0.5) * (1 - 0.2)] = 0.72 = 72% DR
Or you can just apply them to DR on your own.
Example: 100 damage shot against someone with 30% DR, 50% DR and 20% DR:
100 damage with 30% reduced = 70 damage
70 damage with 50% reduced = 35 damage
35 damage with 20% reduced = 28 damage (overall 72% DR)
Thank you very much.
Infantry:
WtS - Dind't use. Seems not quite as necessary to me at least compared to other classes that can be bio tanks. An infantry biotank doesn't bring anything special to the table imo.
Sentinel - Did use. Much weaker as it used to be. Overwatch does not work on enemies which are not in LOS and thinmen ignore overwatch with snapshot. I stopped making overwatch builds.
Grenadier - Did use. Jack of all trades, master of none, but still my preferred infantry build. Grenades are limited in their use but they are very necessary. Just think of chryssalids or the massive Muton DR when in full cover. Infantry can shoot twice when the enemy is out of grenade range and I think that the other infantry builds are week, so I tend to put my infantry on grenade duty.
Gunner:
WtS - Did use. Probably the strongest gunner build right now. Tankiest bio tank if Grit is taken, but this comes at the cost of CST though.
Sentinel - Did use. Same as with infantry. Overwatch classes have suffered. I stopped making them.
Mayhem - Did use. The bullet wizard lost the ability to suppress two turns in a row which was quite a huge blow to this build. It didn't reach the full potential of this build yet (predictive tracking), but so far it felt weak to me.
Sniper:
ITZ - Did use. Requires a lot of setup. Steading in the beginning of a fight instead of taking a shot results in more damage taken. In 2 out 3 turns he doesn't offer any contribution to the damage of the team. In 1 out of 3 turns he deals all his damage and needs to be set up properly for this particular turn and the alien sometimes mess up your setup with their positioning. This build is definitely much weaker than it used to be. I stopped making ITZ snipers.
Mayhem - Did use. Probably the strongest sniper build right now since ITZ is in a bad spot imo. Works with both sniper rifle and strike rifle giving you the option the be more mobile if necessary. The overall damage is comparable to ITZ I think, but this damage is not delayed which will make your tank live longer.
DT - Didn't use. The overall damage and the ammo consumption feels weak to me. I guess DT could be OK for flanking with a strike rifle though. Also there is the option for DT holo similar to what engineers are able to do. This is basically more of a support build for snipers. But unlike engineers the "support sniper" will not be able to heal your SHIV.
Scout:
Smoke and Mirrors - Did use. Support grenades are mandatory. Think of thinmen dropping in with active overwatch. Think of the mobility of chryssalids. But is the Scout the best option for it? I don't think so. He tends up to end up too far away for good use of flashbangs in my games.
Snapshot - Did use. Probably the strongest Scout build right now if luck is on your side, but luck can let you down of course. My snapshot scouts were stronger than my ITZ snipers so far but mainly because ITZ is in a bad spot right now.
H&R: Didn't use. Probably best for flanking. But I don't feel like this will help much in big fights in the mid or late game.
Medic:
WtS - Didn't use. The big plus is that he can heal himself and keep on pushing after taking some damage. Having the tank and the healer in one soldier means that you can bring an additional damage dealer with you. But the medic is not as tanky as the other bio tanks and he can be taken out by crits easily if you're unlucky. I think he should be really good with a shotgun on exalt missions. But I wouldn't value him much on other missions.
Sentinel - Did use. Same as with Infantry and gunners. I stopped making overwatch builds.
Smoke and Mirrors - Did use. Someone has to bring support grenades and imo the medic is the best for that. He tends up to be in the middle of the team and can make good use of both flashbangs and smoke grenades. I always use a medkit in the first gear slot. So there are only 2 slots available for support grenades unfortunately.
Assault:
R&G - Did use. Glass canon. Super good in some situations, terrible in others. I like bringing them to missions that have a low number of enemies. That speeds up the fights without too much risks.
Grenadier - Did use. Grenading while trying to get into CE range does work to some extend, but such Assaults tend to get wounded or killed. They can't choose their positions quite as well as R&G Assaults and they don't have the tankiness of WtS Assaults.
WtS - Did use. This is the more aggressive tank option. Assaults work best when they can get close to the enemy. Making them tanky does reduce the risks involved with closing the distance. I leave a radom "CLOSE RANGE?" meme here. :)
Engineer:
Grenadier - Didn't use. Technically the best class to remove short range cover or chryssalids. But it's kind of a one trick pony. Might make one for terror missions at some point.
Smoke and Mirrors - Didn't use. This build works very similar to the support medic with the benefit of holo rounds and one more slot available for support grenades (since my engineers don't carry medkits) at the cost of Shadowstep. But I prefer having only one support grenadier in my team and I went for medic support grenadier because I don't like the other medic builds currently.
DT - Did use. Double holo (as long DT is not on CD) is helpful. Holo is mandatory since some enemies are really hard to hit. I like putting my engineers on holo duty.
Rocketeer:
LEU - Did use. The most versatile Rocketeer build. I value the combination of LEU and Holo Rounds. It helps the team while the rocket is on CD.
Smoke and Mirrors - Did not use. As described before I felt Medics are best suited for Support grenades because of the lack of other good builds. As for support Rocketeers: Once they run out rockets and support grenades they become useless. May be good for shorter missions, but definitely not good for long missions. Sometimes I would like to use both a rocket and support grenades in the same turn. With the rocketeer you basically have to decide which one to use in a given turn.
Grenadier - Did not use. They should be awesome for terror missions in theory. Rocket the floaters, grenade the chryssalids. But as described before I think infantry is best on grenade duty because of the lack of other good infantry builds. Also you have only 2 slots remaining for grenades if you put a rocket into the first slot.
Summary of my "go to" builds for general use and their roles in the team right now:
- Grenadier Infantry => Grenade duty, LEU otherwise
- WtS Gunner => Tanking duty, suppress
- WtS Assault => Tanking duty, good against close ranged / not hardened enemies (hi EXALT)
- Mayhem Sniper => Take out or injure dangerous targets
- Snapshot Scout => Scouting duty, good against seekers, execute low HP targets
- Smoke and Mirrors Medic => Heal bio tanks, good against overwatch spam
- DT Engineer => Heal SHIV, holo duty
- LEU Rocketeer => Rockets in case of emergency, holo duty otherwise
Thanks =D
I have a question that I've never been able to satisfactorily answer - I always feel I could have done better:
How do people decide who to GM and who to Officer?
Psi and MEC are relatively simple to select, but I'm never really sure that I have left the right units GM-free to upgrade to Officers (or promoted the ones that should've been modified).
Any thoughts?
Cheers!
I think the best bet is to find how you really want gene mods on, who you really want psi on, then focus on the officer after.