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soupdragon1234

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Better behaviours for Hearthfires adopted kids and spouse

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Post all bugs or potential issues to the Bug reports section where I can keep an eye on them. Thanks.

RECENT UPDATES TO HEARTHFIRES MEAN THAT YOU MAY HAVE ISSUES TRYING TO MOVE TO THE CREATION CLUB HOUSE.
I'm looking into this at present. Dialogue looks like it ought to be straightforward to fix, script changes may take longer to track down. Thats the vanilla HF version I can't do anything with the Multiple Adoptions version until TMPhoenix updates his mod.
 
In the meantime you should be able to remove this mod if its a problem (make sure they aren't following you and move them to a different house and back if need be afterwards)

n.b.I plan to release the updated LE version to SSE especially now that SKSE64 is in Beta it'd make sense to update the whole lot together.




Does the Hearthfires adoption system seem lacking to you?
Do you wish your adopted kids would talk to each other?
Do you wish your kids would talk to your spouse?!
Or your housecarl? Or infact anyone except you!

Tired of your kids hanging around like a lemon all day outside?!
Ever wish the kids in town would just hang out or play together?


Fed up with your spouse moping about the house all day
and wish they'd go outside, or visit the market
like the kids always say but never actually do!

Tired of your kids saying, "oh the kids in Dragonsreach are mean!" Or "I  wish they'd let me inside the Blue Palace! Or even make a trip to the Temple of Dibella (they say they have, but you'll never see it!)

Ever wondered why you can leave your family for days on end
and they never wonder where you've got to?!

Find it frustrating that you can tell your kids to meet you at a new home but they never accompany you there! How did they get there? Fly on the back of a dragon? Magic?!

Well know know they can do all those things!
This mod contains over a dozen dialogue scenes between the kids and others between your spouse and housecarl.
Your kids will hang out with other kids when they're in town, and join them in running around town.
They'll actually visit the places they say they do!
If you've been missing for 3 or more days they'll send the Courier packing
with a message for you!
You can ask your kids and spouse to accompany you to your new home and have them follow you there! (conditions apply).



So what does this mod do?
Your kids and other kids in town will play/hang out together
Optional travel with your family to new home.
Kids will now visit Dragonsreach/Dibella Temple/Orphanage/Blue Palace/Lake at Lakeview (with optional plugin)
Kids will talk to each other/spouse/housecarl
Your spouse will cook meals/sit with your family together
Your spouse will actually sleep in bed at nighttime.
Courier will come looking for you if you're absent for a while (three days) with a plea to return home soon.


So whats the point of it?
Honestly I was tired of the complete non-speech kids have when not talking to the player, the house is in almost complete silence. Anyone knows real kids aren't that quiet in real life! They don't acknowledge each other or your spouse or anyone else for that matter. They talk about "fishing in the lake" or "dragonsreach kids are mean" but they never actually do or visit those places/things. They don't even acknowledge or play with the other kids in town.  I wanted something to add more life, colour and variety to the family home and life and make it more... immersive. (Yes I really did consider "immersive adoptions" as a name for this mod)! Not being able to take your family anywhere bugged me too.


What is required?
It comes in two flavours, vanilla hearthfires and TMPhoenix's Multiple Adoptions mod. Use either one of those versions. (Yes Mr Phoenix's mod is required if you're using that flavour). Then choose either the original version (less compatible, but better combat AI) or the alternative version (more compatible but less good combat package).


So how do I install it?
Just install with NMM or your favourite mod manager (FOMOD file)
Recommended (optional): Set Skyrim's timescale to 10 or less or events that last only an hour (market, afternoon visits to special places) will likely pass too quickly to finish/notice otherwise.

Move your family to another house in order for the mod to pick up all the changes after installing it.
Improved Adoptions Patch module is not compatible with killable kiddie mods! All vanilla and Hearthfires children are marked as "Essential". Thats necessary to the way the moving quest works (unintended consequences).

Use the "Hush Child" spell thats automatically added (Illusion school of Magic) to shut them up if their chatter becomes too much.
If you want to talk to a child or spouse about moving to a Custom House make sure they're not a follower! The option to move there will not be available!
Dismiss them first!

(Too complex to implement due to the way custom houses work currently, maybe in the future.)





~~ Kids Schedule: ~~
8.00am-9.00am eat breakfast
11.00am -1200 noon visit town marketplace with spouse (if available)
12.00-1.00pm hang out in town
1.00pm-4.00pm run around town with friends (if available)
4.00pm-5.00pm visit those places they never visit!
~~ Special schedule at DLC house 1+2 if plugin installed ~~
11.00am-1.00pm hang out outside
1.00pm-3.00pm play outside (have a run around)
3.00pm-5.00pm visit jetty at Lakeview or hatchery at Winstad
(accompanied by House Steward - if available)


~~ Spouse Schedule (optional) ~~
7.00am-8.00am cook meal for family
8.00am-9.00am sit and eat meal with family
11.00am-1.00pm browse the market in town (if available)
4.00pm-5.00pm cook meal for family
5.00pm-6.pm sit and eat meal with family
12.00a.m-7.00am sleep


Ok heres the small print. Consists of 3 separate plugins.
Each have varying levels of compatiblity.
Most compatible is the main file. 
This should be compatible with just about anything except
any mod that modifies the adoption quest system.
The DLC house plugin is likely not compatible with anything that
modifies the exteriors of DLC houses and possibly the interiors too.
The Improved Adoptions Patch is the least compatible! 
Modifies some vanilla quests and requires SKSE! 
Probably not compatible with Spouse/Marriage mods!





F.A.Q's / Known problems!

Ok, so you've got a problem. Please check first:
a) you're using the correct version i.e. Standard Version or Multiple Adoptions Version, depending on your usage. 
b) HearthfireMultiKid.esp is enabled in your load order (if using Multiple Adoptions Version).



There are compatibility issues with marriage mods/custom voiced spouses, 
check out the "miscellaneous" files section for various fixes/workarounds.



Family follower travel to and from Custom Houses is not possible!
Nor can you speak to your spouse/child about moving there while they're following you! Dismiss them first!



Q: Is there no way I can use it with a marriage mod/custom spouse?
A: Use the optional download that disables this mod's spouse quest.

Q: Will there be dialogue with custom voiced spouse and kids? 
A: This is for vanilla voiced spouses only. Kids should be ok so long as they use vanilla voices (Maisha etc). 

Q: I want to take my family to custom houses with the mulitple adoptions version! Why can't I?
A: Unfortunately it differs significantly from the vanilla setup and is currently too unreliable to implement, it'd also likely involve a complete rewrite of the way the custom home quests work and thats not something I feel I have any right to do. Sorry.

Q: But why can't I have them follow when I leave the house to a vanilla house? That makes no sense!
A: The way the custom house quests are set up a move is scheduled everytime you tell your spouse/kids to move even if you cancel the move later. So imagine you told your kid we're going to move, took him away with you then told him we're going to stay you return to the home... and your family is gone. Only the family move quest thinks we've returned home so gets throughly confused. At best your kid will now walk or run all the way to Whiterun or Solitude or wherever the family have gone to. Not ideal and no way to change it either.

Q: Do I need to dismiss my current followers so my family can follow me?
A: No, its a custom follower framework so they can follow as well as existing followers.

Q: Do I need UFO or EFF or other follower mod to make them follow? Can I manage them with it?
A: No and no, its custom follower framework and independent of the vanilla follower system or follower mods.

Q: Why can't I tell my kids to pick this up or sit there or carry my crap like any other follower!
A: Its intended as a get-you-there package for your family and not a full on follower mod. You can't pickpocket kids or access their inventory usually so... yeah. I felt it was inappropriate.

Q: How do I make my kids less cowardly to danger when following? They always run away screaming!
A: Talk to your child follower give them a proper weapon (dagger) and tell them you're right with them at all times. That'll increase their confidence level in dealing with enemies. They'll revert back to normal when they arrive.

Q: They're useless fighters! They're always going down!
A: Give them a daedric dagger or some other high level weapon, that'll even it out somewhat.

Q: I want to give them armour! And more health!
A: Maybe in the future. Someday.

Q: But I don't want my kids turning into little warriors! I want them to stay innocent!
A: Don't give them a pep talk and they'll stay just as they always were.

Q: Why does one of my child followers vanish and reappear as soon as I've arrived at our new home destination?! Whats going on?

A: You noticed hey? Ok, heres the long and the short of it. The way Bethesda set up the adoption system is  when the family moves home one child, usually the first one to be adopted, has to be inside the family home when the move occurs. So when you arrive the adoption scripts will instantly teleport them inside and perform the family move functions. Normally this odd vanilla function occurs off-camera when you're in a different location so you don't notice it but here you do. It looks funky but there is no way to avoid it without a complete rewrite of the way the adoption system works and thats likely to break compatibility with just about everything in existence so has approximately 0.00% chance of ever happening. 

Q: Why can't I dismiss my family when away from home?!
You want to abandon your family in the middle of nowhere?! Leave them to the bears and wolves and trolls like some cold blooded heartless monster?! Well sorry you can't do that. Not in this version anyway. What do you mean you are a cold blooded heartless, monster and you want to do it anyway?! Well maybe later. Or then again, maybe not.

Q: How do I get horses for my kids/spouse?!
A: You don't have to do anything special. Just jump on your horse theirs will show up afterwards.

Q: Thats quite a cheat!
A: Possibly. I  might add a proper acquire-horses-quest later. Its not a priority right now.

Q: Where is my horse?!
A: You'll have to get your own. Thats enough cheating for now!

Q: I don't need horses getting in my way/dying in the middle of combat!
A: They're all set to cowardly by default so will run away at the first sign of combat. They're also unkillable.

Q: So why can't I ride/steal my kids/spouses horses?!

A: Official lore friendly response: the horses were gifted by "a friend" to your family and not you.
Unofficial technical response: it tends to mess up the quest that handles them so can't be allowed unfortunately.

Q: My spouse/child on horseback has vanished/horse has frozen/
I can walk right through it!

A: Its a game engine bug.  Horse riding for NPC's is riddled with bugs Bethesda likely never fully committed to  follower horse riding and as a result never straightened them all out.
Dismount/mount your horse, failing that fast travel somewhere else. That should make them show up again.

Q: How do I make my kids shut up? They won't stop chattering!
A: Use the "Hush Child!" spell added to you you'll find it under the Ilusion school of magic.
Cast it on one of your kids. It'll maybe take a minute or two before they stop.
(No you don't need to find a spell book. Its added to you automatically)

Q: The dialogue is getting really repetitive! How do I change it?
A: Unfortunately theres no way I know of telling it which dialogue to play or not to play the same again. Dialogue scenes are generated randomly by the game's Story Manager and sometimes it'll simply play the same ones all over again. You can always disable their dialogue if it becomes a bit much.

Q: The dialogue, I've heard that before somewhere!
A: Its edited and recomposed vanilla dialogue. So why don't I just record new? Because new voice acting is fine for new NPC's but with vanilla npc's it just sounds out of place and won't match. Because no VA can match the vanilla voices exactly especially children. Most mod children voices are simply adults pretending to be children, and it shows.

Q: Looks cool, how long did it take you to write it?
A: Too long! More than two and a half years. I've never done any modding before in my life so had to learn.
Every. Little. Thing. From scratch. And boy were there a lot of bugs.

Q: Can I merge the files together?
A: You should be able to merge the DLC Houses plugin but probably not the IA Patch as it contains scripts and quests which usually don't merge successfully, DLC houses has neither. You also ought to be be able to merge with my other mod "Smart No More Stupid Dog comments" too.

Q: Do you intend making a patch for <insert name here> mod?
As it stands I have little or no interest in doing that. If anyone else wants to release a patch go ahead you have my permission. 

Q: Is it compatible with RDO (Relationship Dialogue Overhaul)?
A: It should be, there are no conflicts that I can see. I use it myself and havn't come across any problems.

Q: Is it compatible with Storefront?
A: This seems to be asked a lot so I've added it to the FAQ's (I don't use it infact I'd never heard of it before new). Ok here it is: Family Travel on IA Patch is incompatible (stall won't move unless you head indoors or otherwise change location) while DLC Houses module is partially compatible in that the stall will be partly sunk into the road outside Lakeview (still usable, even if it looks a bit odd) you
could try moving it with Jaxonz Positioner mod.

Main module should be fine as intended but Storefront will override spouse behaviours during stall opening times i.e. 8 a.m. - 6 p.m. 

Q: Is it compatible with Hearthfires Extended by Kinaga?
A: Mostly. There are a few minor conflicts with the DLC Houses plugin namely the road to the jetty at Lakeview might be a bit lumpy, the leveled Warlock at the nearby Altar might show up again until you speak to labourer to remove it. Kids may not play games (Tag, Hide and Seek) correctly if at Lakeview Jetty.

~ Putting this mod lower in the load order than HE should fix the kids games and the Warlock at least. And don't purchase the road upgrade for HE ~ 

Q: Is it compatible with Open Cities?
A: Not currently. Maybe later.
N.B. Open Cities is a fundamental rewrite of the way Skyrim works so unless a mod specifically states its compatible you ought to assume that it isn't, rather than the other way around.



Thanks to TMPhoenix for help, suggestions, bug testing and kind permissions.
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