To be real, though, I would pay REAL SCHMEKELS for a combination of this and Curse of the Firmament. Having one set to a racial choice at launch, and the other being accessed through standing stones. Double the DOUBLE THE PAIN
Was very excited to return from ~2 months of hiatus and check out more sleeper hit aljoxo mods (and ofc big hitter Apostasy !), but didn't expect to find a standing stone overhaul as cool as this one. Less pronounced/more limited buffs like those granted by the stones are imo perfect for turning into tradeoffs, especially for players who can, at this point, navigate blindfolded to any one of the standing stones from Helgen Keep to hit-and-run rush their buffs.
In general, I think the macro-design choice of double-edged buffs is unfortunately unexplored, or at least undersupported compared to progression mods with less "baggage" in terms of what using them entails. I'd like to one day try out stuff like tjhm4's Master of One, as imo it's super creative and meticulous in its design choices, but there's some apprehension in me about reorienting my load order around a mod that makes such far-reaching and fundamental changes to every aspect the game's main progression system.
Not sure how I feel about the new Serpent. Its certainly more imaginative than the original but I don't know how I vibe with it. I get you want it to be a stealth stone which I understand but disagree with. The Serpent is about being blessed or cursed and I feel stealth, while it can fit, kinda pigeon holes it. I did like the AOE regen debuff and I think it could make for a really cool "You can end a fight quickly but it will be awful it drags on."
Random effects can be annoying but that it is accurate to the sign, it randomly appears and its effects vary from person to person, so I would prefer that trajectory over the stealth but that's just me.
PS: Don't remember if the Ritual was changed or if it has always been the Magic/Stamina but I like it. It seems like a bit of a weak thing on paper but I think it would make for a really cool bound weapon build.
Ritual Stone has remained unchanged. I really like the stone the way it is, but it seems that is contrary to the general feedback I've received. I'm currently floating a few ideas in my head about what else can be done with it (I refuse to make it a summoner stone).
I decided to make Serpent Stone the "Stealth" stone because there wasn't already one and I'm pretty happy with the way the Shadow Stone functions.
I like what the Ritual stone goes for and I don't think there are any big changes you can make without falling into the Apprentice or Atronarch. I like it being focused on pre-combat. It being used for setting up buffs and rituals before a fight is cool. If you were to change it then maybe it can be something like increased spell duration when casted outside of combat
if I changed it, it would likely be staff/scroll focused, there just really isn't much interesting stuff you can do with those two things without making them incredibly overpowered
@aljoxo Anything that makes the game harder(but still balanced) is always welcome to my load order, tanks a bunch for this ! If you don't mind, I have some suggestions: As a player who doesn't care much about the economy(mostly used what I can find in the battle), the gold-related changes will not impact me that much. Because of this, I think if it changed to something more "combat-oriented", it'll suit most cases. Example: 1.The Lady Stone drawback: Instead of costing gold, it'll reduce our Magicka and/or Stamina by 50%, so in the meaning time of the Lady's Favor effect, we'll be encouraged to be defensive. 2.The Thief stone drawback: Instead of receiving 25% worse prices, it'll reduce our Health regeneration in combat by a specific % amount, this will encourage us to play like a thief, and avoid direct confrontation whenever possible ! These are the only 2 things that I would like to be changed, everything else is already sweet and lovely. What do you think about this ?
1. I'm pretty happy with the way the Lady Stone currently functions. Honestly a Cheat Death with no cooldown needs some type of "cost", in this case I took a very literal approach to this problem. I also think it can serve the use case of being an efficient gold sink for higher level characters so I don't foresee myself changing it. (Also I just had a lot of fun implementing the effect, it was by far one of the coolest things I did in the mod from a technical POV, I think)
2. Thief Stone and Serpent Stone were very difficult for me; in the case of the Thief Stone, there just aren't that many bonuses you can give to "Stealth" characters (especially in most modded setups where Stealth characters actively don't require Stamina or any similar buffs due to poor gameplay design). My thought process with the Thief Stone was "It's a pretty harmless, early to mid game choice for most people if they want to make more gold for whatever reason" and the price detriment seemed fitting from both an RP perspective and as a way to offset the bonuses granted by the Stone (which at the end of the day my goal is to make the bonuses and debuffs "make sense").
I appreciate the feedback though. I will keep these in mind depending on future feedback people give me when I inevitably redesign certain stones.
@aljoxo Yeah, your approach is interesting and lore-friendly, I agree, just not really something I'm interested in... About the Lady Stone, instead of using a fixed amount from the beginning(500 gold), don't you think we should use a percent amount(%) based on our gold at the moment so it'll be more viable for early-game characters ?
While doable, it is also much more abuseable (just store or drop your gold) and would require a heavier script to pull off. Also if it was a percentage, you would never proc the debuff. A fixed value is also just easier to tune in the long run for me.
I'll keep this in mind, pending future feedback once people get the chance to actually try out the mod. I don't really want to start making drastic changes to the scaling and bonuses/debuffs off of first impressions and theorycrafting.
As I already mentioned on the Nirn's Chosen Page, I really do look forward to trying this out. I don't want to sound pretentious but seeing your history of derequiemifying 3BF, I see a lot of similarities which I really enjoy (The Lover and Tower specifically). It lets me get a taste of Requiem without honeypotting myself into it lol. Looks fun and excited to see it.
PS: Is Wombum intended or is it a error for Wombburn?
27 comments
In general, I think the macro-design choice of double-edged buffs is unfortunately unexplored, or at least undersupported compared to progression mods with less "baggage" in terms of what using them entails. I'd like to one day try out stuff like tjhm4's Master of One, as imo it's super creative and meticulous in its design choices, but there's some apprehension in me about reorienting my load order around a mod that makes such far-reaching and fundamental changes to every aspect the game's main progression system.
Random effects can be annoying but that it is accurate to the sign, it randomly appears and its effects vary from person to person, so I would prefer that trajectory over the stealth but that's just me.
PS: Don't remember if the Ritual was changed or if it has always been the Magic/Stamina but I like it. It seems like a bit of a weak thing on paper but I think it would make for a really cool bound weapon build.
I decided to make Serpent Stone the "Stealth" stone because there wasn't already one and I'm pretty happy with the way the Shadow Stone functions.
If you don't mind, I have some suggestions: As a player who doesn't care much about the economy(mostly used what I can find in the battle), the gold-related changes will not impact me that much. Because of this, I think if it changed to something more "combat-oriented", it'll suit most cases. Example:
1.The Lady Stone drawback: Instead of costing gold, it'll reduce our Magicka and/or Stamina by 50%, so in the meaning time of the Lady's Favor effect, we'll be encouraged to be defensive.
2.The Thief stone drawback: Instead of receiving 25% worse prices, it'll reduce our Health regeneration in combat by a specific % amount, this will encourage us to play like a thief, and avoid direct confrontation whenever possible !
These are the only 2 things that I would like to be changed, everything else is already sweet and lovely. What do you think about this ?
2. Thief Stone and Serpent Stone were very difficult for me; in the case of the Thief Stone, there just aren't that many bonuses you can give to "Stealth" characters (especially in most modded setups where Stealth characters actively don't require Stamina or any similar buffs due to poor gameplay design). My thought process with the Thief Stone was "It's a pretty harmless, early to mid game choice for most people if they want to make more gold for whatever reason" and the price detriment seemed fitting from both an RP perspective and as a way to offset the bonuses granted by the Stone (which at the end of the day my goal is to make the bonuses and debuffs "make sense").
I appreciate the feedback though. I will keep these in mind depending on future feedback people give me when I inevitably redesign certain stones.
About the Lady Stone, instead of using a fixed amount from the beginning(500 gold), don't you think we should use a percent amount(%) based on our gold at the moment so it'll be more viable for early-game characters ?
I don't really want to start making drastic changes to the scaling and bonuses/debuffs off of first impressions and theorycrafting.
PS: Is Wombum intended or is it a error for Wombburn?
let me check if it was just the page or also in the mod aswell.
Thanks for pointing that out.
Edit: Looks like I correctly named the effect in the mod, just typo'd while creating the mod page.