More or less. My mod scans for the skill levels rather than for classes. This is to maximize compatibility with mods adding new classes or combat styles and also keeping this easier to manage. In this example the necromancer may get the perk if they have a high enough restoration skill, but possibly also healing perks for the living, which they likely won't make use of anyways.
Well, looking through the SPID documentation it seems to be possible to a degree to scan for spells and weapons. But whether scanning for spells or weapons being better than combat styles or classes is something I can't say when it comes to compatibility with other mods. Both cases would have their own needs for patches to work with some other mods as intended. While in the end having an archer with some dagger or basic alteration perks they can't use shouldn't cause any issue whatsoever and is irrelevant gameplay wise IMHO.
For the Adamant version I manually assigned perks. Such as Necromancers with poison spells would also always have access to some poison perks in the Restoration Tree.
curious if I can achieve a similar result with SPID for Vokriinator.
I took a look at your mod and yes, you could use factions as intended to scan for appropriate characters to get the perk. Alternatively you can use "Wildcards", which I could never really get to work and thus used the third option; direct name scanning for my "NPC drop hearts and flesh" mod, which can be a bit finicky at times. If you wanted to give Novice and Adapt Necromancers a perk you will have to specify them separately through this method, so Wildcards are a better choice here.
Guide here. The Syntax looks as follows in general: FormType = FormOrEditorID|StringFilters|FormFilters|LevelFilters|TraitFilters|CountOrPackageIndex|Chance
Final result via Faction (Without access to xEdit right now..): ;Example Perk Perk = 0x12345~Adamant.esp|NONE|0x54321|16(30)|NONE|NONE|25 This would give the example perk to everyone in the faction specified - but not actually existing... - to those with a Restoration level of at least 30 with a chance of 25 %
You will have to replace XXXXX with the ID of the perk and replace Placeholder with the esp/esm you want to target. Perk numbers can be seen in the guide (0-17) And chances can now be between 0.1 and 100. IDs, names, etc. Can be looked up via xEdit.
It can be quite "some" work, but this would eliminate potential conflicts, that would arise with a standard esp. Of course you can do so much more via SPID, those are just some basic examples on what to expect how your SPID file may look like.
Oooohhh! NEAT! Another approach at Vokriinator is really appreciated! And thank you for linking my mod as recommended, I also added yours as an alternative requirement to Vokriinator! :3
When I release the 1.0 build with details on the addition of a few Adamant perks, and the Vokrii mysticism perks, would you have any interest in helping support tailored version of Vokriinator Perks for NPCs for Vokord? ... possibly with this mod in mind? Enemy Onslaught Revamped
It was actually on my list when I saw your sticky about the 1.0 release! I will go through what I already have up and running and would compare it with what your mod is doing differently and adjust accordingly. ^^
Admittingly, I'm not sure if Adamant / Mystisism compatibility will be a thing though.. 1. I have everything set up for Odin and am a manual modder - yup those still exist~ and am already months behind schedule... (The Mystisism requirement and potential compatibility issues are the reasons I chose the base version of Vokriinator btw) 2. I REALLY can't bring myself to boot into windows anymore despite loving to mod - more of a lack of proper accessibility features compared to Linux really. 3. I'm actually also thinking about pulling back from the modding scene. (unwillingly mind you)
So, while I will gladly adjust my mod to work better for Vokord, a proper version may not happen on my part. Of course it is only really a thing of what the ID is named for me to set things up properly, so you could just name the IDs for the Adamant / Mystisims stuff and I could include them (with credits). Alternatively it may be better if I update the existing things and then you take over that version if you want to?
I should clarify that Vokord doesn’t require Adamant. I duplicated a few of the perks, and NPCs can’t use em all. Plus those in Enai’s Vokrii mysticism patch. Combined, these are currently the additional perks. IMG
For the most part Enemy Onslaught is just SRCEO with additional spells given to casters to flesh out their distinction a bit more where they would benefit more from certain perk trees. Would it be easier if I created and assigned a few custom classes with modified skill weight?
was curious on your thoughts/preference to Odin vs Mysticism?
Thank you for the image! I will take a look at it later and make an alpha release of this distributor specifically for Vokord! :3 And yes, I've read about Adamant not being a requirement and actually integrated partially. Personally I think that's a great idea to increase the diversity further with (hopefully) less of a compatibility nightmare!
As for custom classes; yes, they MAY benefit from a custom class, but to me the difference is really just minimal since the amount of attributes and skill levels are restricted per level, no matter what you enter - attributes are 6 and skills I believe also. The work to assign those classes can become quite tiresome for potentially small differences. I would only recommend doing custom classes for custom characters, as it's easier to make them rather than find a fitting one, whereas I believe (or hope) that the existing characters and their classes are well enough fleshed out to properly benefit from SPID mods. So, no, I wouldn't go that extra mile for a potentially tiny change.
Odin vs. Mysticism: I actually used Mysticism for much longer than Odin and liked it. It's just so damn cluttered with spells doing the same with just more powerful versions, whereas Odin is a bit simpler. Especially notable with lock and resistance spells. Mysticism has 5 open lock spells (for each level) and many resistance spells for each element individually. Odin has 2 weaken lock spells and 2 resistance spells for all the elements, which is far easier to handle. Mysticism turns master level spells into one-handed casts, Odin allows mind influencing spells to have a chance to work on higher level targets. Both have their allure in that case, but as anti-mage wanting more diversity for NPCs and loving illusion, it's a no-brainer to not see that a Embershard bandit is fully immune to fury anymore! Otherwise they don't differ that much IMO. Apocalypse folks will also benefit with Odin as duplicate spells will be skipped, so even less unnecessary clutter to deal with! Those 2 mods really need to be tested to determine which one works better though, both are great in their own ways!
And while I'm currently merely tracking your mod, I would most likely switch to it if there was a version suited for Odin users without the need for Mysticism (didn't bring it up till now, because I wanted to give you time to set everything up first ^^; )
I have had a few requests for Odin so I can look into it. In the meantime the apocalypse adjusted patch for Vokord does actually include some mysticism spells removed from the level n shop lists. It was part of my personal redundancy patch that I decided to include. I may fine tune it a little more.
I have uploaded my first test file HERE. I haven't tested it myself for already mentioned reason(s) though, so I hope I have set everything up properly. It's a very basic test version, just to determine if everything works or if some perks are not intended to be used for NPCs. Let me know if everything works as intended - the SPID log within the documents folder can give a quick look here - or if there is something that needs changing. Also wasn't sure about 2 perks and their skill requirements, (Disorienting Blow & ;Underworld Contacts) as well as if I targeted the right plugins. ^^
Disorienting Blow is a block perk connecting from Stunning Strike Perk and requires 60 blocking "Bashing causes enemies to take 25% more damage for 10 seconds. ". Sorry it's actual name is disorienting bash in game. It's in the vokriinator.esp.
Underworld contracts would be moot since it just increases sale prices to fences.
One thing to note is the Vokrii - Mysticism patch should have precedent over the Mysticism ordinator patch. Alternation we'd want to be using the vokrii mysticism patch perks for example.
(Alteration) 70 - Greater Malison (replaces arcane guidance): Weakness spells reduce resistances by an additional 25%.
(Alteration) 90 - Telekinetic Crush: Grand Telekinesis deals 20 magic damage per second to levitated targets.
I am a bit confused by references to MysticOrdinator.esp under Conjuration, Illusion and Restoration. The MysticOrdinator.esp does not contain perk records on my end, just magic effects?
to integrate this into the existing Vokriinator perks for NPCs I can just add these lines in the manner you instructed in the earlier comment to duplicate how it is in the released SPID?
Thank you for the update! I have uploaded a new version with the changes on the same link: Underworld Contacts has been removed, Disorienting Bash has been updated, all instances of ordinator targeting is now directed to the Vokrii patch instead. I'm also a bit torn about the Restoration perks Withering & Corrosion as it seems they had a different Plugin ID than the others. Sorry, I'm pretty much doing this blindly without modding tools as I'm a bit too lazy/blind to do things in windows anymore as well as do all the changes to my manual setup for a simple test file, so errors can happen, that's why I preferred doing this test file before a public release.. ^^;
And yes, you could add the perks from that file to the real upload and do some changes to make them more gameplay friendly if you want to. But once everything is properly set and targeted, I will do a proper and public release of the Vokord version, unless you would prefer taking over of course?
If you're wanting to do a public release that'd be great. I can do whatever you need to help out.
With regards to withering and corrosion. I believe it's because they are exclusive forms/perks in the vokrii mysticism patch. The other ones all replace / edit existing vokrii perks.
Okay, I did one more update to the file and also checked the Vokrii perks within XEdit just in case, everything should be working now and I should be able to do a public / proper release soon-ish! Although I will need some more days as I'm rather busy with things right now..
If I have moved the unarmed perks from light armor to two handed will this require any special tweak for NPC distribution? The names of the perks, the ID and the required perks remain the same, but they require skill in two handed instead of light armor.
Sounds like a simple enough change to do in the .ini files, only changing the skill tree (6 -> 1) and nothing else from the looks. If names, IDs, perk plugin origin, skill level requirements and the description stay the same with merely switching to Two handed, it's only a matter of minutes actually. :3 Added a note in my file so I won't forget or anything, although I will go through the entire perk list once everything is set up and running of course. And thank you for pointing this out! I already read on your description that there were some changes about unarmed perks, but admittedly forgot about asking it in the end.. :P
Edit: Leaving the distribution as is won't break anything btw, it's just not consistent with the requirements of the player.
Coo coo. Two handed skill would contribute to unarmed damage at any rate.
Some perks I have reduced the number of multitple points you can spend while increasing the progression jump, as I wanted to reduce the number of 3 level perks.
Doesn’t really change much for NPCs since as in most cases the putting 2 points into a perk would equal putting 3 points where I slimmed the progression. level 3 still exists but is just not accessible to the player.
Was debating making mastery points just 1 level but more conflicted about that.
Tentative build to combine the mastery levels 1-2 into just one mastery perk per skill tree similar to Vokrii, since there are so many perks already in Vokord.
Essentially it means that first mastery perk in any skill tree is going to be very impactful out of the gate, but that may have balance implications early game. what are your thoughts?
Hey! Sorry about the silence, too much crap going on IRL and couldn't bring myself to write to anyone, so please don't take it personal..
Anyways; I know there is a mod to raise mastery perk levels to 5, which should be working with Vokord out of the box, but that's clearly too much to invest IMO. Whether to leave mastery perks at 2 or lower it to just 1 I'm not quite sure, as 1 sounds a bit too strong whereas 2 would take more perk points away you would want to invest in other stuff. On the other hand reducing the 3 tier perks to just 2 while keeping their strength at a similar level sounds like a really good decision to make the mod less intimidating IMO.
As for work on my part; I assume if you ditch the 3rd tier, I would probably just do the same and change the level requirements of the first 2 tiers (If at all) for everything to stay in sync. With the mastery perks it would need to be those coming from Ordinator for me to only do minor changes, as my mod scans for the xxx00 and xxx20 IDs, but changing that into the Vokrii IDs instead won't be such an issue either.
I'm just not sure if there will be an update this year since there is currently too much happening IRL and I don't have the head for modding among other things. And also sorry in advance if I'm not responding for a while again..
No big rush. I am working on a Dragonborn Bestiary project and a SPID for spell distribution version of Revamped Releveled + Enemy Onslaught. I assume I'd use a similar method for spell distribution as is used for perk distribution?
Somewhat similar, yes. Having low level perks distributed to NPCs that don't have any use for them is one thing, but spells can potentially cause balancing issues the way I see it. Not sure if I'm the right person here to ask honestly. The skill requirements and chances might be the only things that you can carry over from my way.
Personally I would probably scan for both; classes and combat styles SEPERATELY, as mod support is always a concern IMO and you should make sure the right NPCs get the correct spells (I got a SPID mod that gives Whiterun citizens the reanimation spells, funny with the Bandit Raid mod, but most people would dislike this) To further combat this, you may also want to try the wildcard approach as well. Like *Pyro or *Pyromancer for fire spells, though this can be a bit restrictive as well. So you may have to test out things with either Classes or Combat styles, with and without wildcards. But in the end it is easily more compatible with other mods than doing it the classic way via ESP edits IMHO.
But no, I don't need anything right now. Took a break from modding to set everything fully up on Linux first and randomly found out how modding would work on Linux, yay! Sadly xedit, Synthesis and Nemesis still bugging out,. so my priority lies in fixing those first before getting back to work at creating the Vokord plugin, but I'll get there eventually! :3
I've also been taking a break. The last stuff I have to do is tedious making more bestiary profile cards for Dragonborn Bestiary. It's not fun stuff. I am also waiting on this mod for Vokord and an update to Extended Cut of Saints and Seducers before I update and release my next guide build. Given me a chance to start actually playing some games in my back log... and buy a bunch more on steam sale.
Hey! Sorry about the silence, sickness caught up with me.. Also struggling heavily with motivation and frustration recently, that I can't even bring myself to touch anything Skyrim anymore aside from yet another pointless attempt at getting Synthesis to finally run without frying my machine.. Ugh, last thing forbidding me to finally ditch windows for good... Can't say when or if I will return to modding though, slowly finding modding more draining than fulfilling as well. But maybe I will find a burst of motivation at some point again and get back to work though.
No worries, I hope you feel better soon. I'd like to take a crack at it. would you be able to send me what you have if you had started anything? Or do I just use the test list you linked above as a reference point?
I may try the implementation of NPCs learn spells and skills
Thank you for understanding, and sorry for taking so damn long for something that really doesn't require THAT much time.. And I'm afraid I haven't really started apart from the reference list posted via G-Drive. With those working, it's mostly just adding proper conditions to them as well as changing some perks as you pointed out previously. It's mainly just getting the first version up and running and the others being copied and a few strings replaced, and yet I'm struggling so badly recently...
It’s coming along well now that I have a decent understanding.
Is there something obvious you look for when you know the perk should not be distributed to NPCs? I was assigning perks in conjuration for example to necromancer and Conjurer but noticed quite a few Ordinator perks are not available in the SPID that seem like they could be ok on NPCs?
Happy to hear it's working out well for you so far! :3
As for determining which perks to distibute; It can be a bit of a b**** at times, where you may have to guess or have blaring sirens, telling you how much use the perks may have on NPCs. I first had this issue in a bug report for the 1H perk Judgment, which would target the player rather than also potentially allowing NPCs. The perk clearly used the player as a reference in this case and the result showed quite well in-game.
So just check for player references in perks? Not quite. Sometimes conditions are also hidden inside spells and magic effects as well as scripts. Meaning you would have to check up on each perk / spell / magic effect and possibly their scripts (within xedit is enough) and then determine whether they are safe to use by NPCs or may not work whatsoever.
Aside from checking those out, you may also have to take a look at multiple instances for a perk, where there is a second one with the word "proc" in it's name, those are pretty much guaranteed to cause issues if you ask me.
Fortunately you would only have to check up on everything that has changed between my base Vokriinator and your Vokord, so it's not too much bug hunting or more like player reference hunting really. Again, some are pretty obvious, others may be more hidden and harder to understand if NPCs can do anything with those perks at all. But checking up on all perks / spells / magic effects directed to the perks and referencing the player or not should be enough to figure this one out.
So quite a few factors to consider. One I was curious about was ;Plague Doctor Nearby opponents get 25% weakness to poison and disease
I do see it's condition is subject is player, could this just be changed to subject is caster instead for NPCs to use it? Or would it then just reduce the resistances of him and his allies?
I also notice quite a few of the elemental destruction perks are not distributed to NPCs
Hmmm.. It's difficult to say if doing that change will work as intended. Just today got a bug report about a seemingly safe to use perk for NPCs, which has some undesired side effects, so it's not always clear if a perk truly works for NPCs even if it looks perfectly fine for them.
Guess the best you could do is to try it out and see for yourself? As for Plague Doctor; I took a look and aside from various intimidation quests, it seems to be just fine to use for NPCs, I guess it's safe but then again, Distorted Shape sounded fine as well. So even if you try your best to make an as best as possible working NPC addon, it may still break for seemingly no reason.
On the other hand you don't have to worry so much about compatibility with other mods like I would if I would dare change any perks to potentially make them compatible with NPCs as you already got a plugin and patches for your mod. And quite frankly I can't tell you anymore why I decided against the Plague Doctor perk after looking it up.. ^^;
No, they aren't compatible with each other as both mods do their magic separately from each other and thus quickly leading to a higher perk distribution than was intended. Having both installed together won't break your game or lead to duplicated perks though, it'll just break the balance.
Fair enough. However, I'm wondering if there is a way to remove the perk distribution from EEOS and just keep everything else that mod adds (spells, shouts, etc.) while using your perks here. I think that would be optimal.
Hmmm.. Looking over the contents to say what needs to be removed, I noticed that there are neither Ordinator nor Vokrii addons available. I was absolutely certain it also had these mods covered.. I could have sworn I saw them at some point actually..
That being said; It is actually FULLY compatible then as my mod requires Vokrii and Ordinator, which EEOS doesn't (anymore??). So you can run them both together without giving out too many perks to NPCs. Sorry about the misinformation, I was absolutely certain it would support Ordinator.. (and possibly Vokrii) Of course, having both mods installed can still greatly increase difficulty, so balancing can still be an issue and may need some fine-tuning.
From what I understood from its description, it should still add some perks to NPCs, though they are probably vanilla perks since it does not require Ordinator or Vokrii, as you said.
Balance is not too much of a concern for me as I am going through the game with a whole party of followers, so I need as much challenge as I can get. On that note, Vokriinator for NPCs works on followers, too, right?
I actually couldn't find mentions about vanilla perks being distributed and that it only seem to use mod added perks. But vanilla perks would be an issue as well however, since Ordinator and Vokrii may replace vanilla perks BUT use the same ID. So if there are vanilla perks, those would increase likeness of NPCs getting the perks further with my mod. Any perks from other mods are perfectly fine and won't cause any issue with this mod however.
And yes, followers are included. If you: 1: Want every character to have the same chance of perk distribution, take the regular version. 2. Don't want followers to gain them, take the no follower version. 3. You could also just have followers gain perks via follower only option. 4. If you want powerful followers and say a 25% chance for other NPCs, you can mix the no follower option and the follower only option as well!
But if challenge is what you seek, then you're probably better off using either the normal or the no follower option.
Yes, all of the named perks in the description are handed to NPCs depending on their skill level. However some perks may not be used by NPCs depending on your load order, like directional movement perks when using MCO for example.
Unlikely, don't like the amount of requirements and won't make one if I'm not using it. There is a link in the description for the black edition though.
Don't know if this is still relevant, but I just realized I had lilmeta's Vokriinator Black SPID files installed for a long time and have only now checked recently with More Informative Console. To be fair, I was too lazy to check the exact distributions but they didn't seem to apply Vokriinator Black perks that often (or if any). While the distributions Stormbl8 made wasn't purpose-built for Vokriinator Black, it applies consistently enough to make a difference in my current playthrough (checked an actor with 100 in twohanded, every perk listed on the mod page is applied correctly). In short, the existing file is already good for Vokriinator Black.
i have vokriinator black and using the suggested file u linked - I'm not really sure if it even works doesn't feel like it does so I'm downloading this one. but just in case the black version is working would there be any issues if i use that one and yours at the same time?
The only issues that would arise when using them both together, would be that Ordinator and Vokrii perks will have an increased chance of being given to NPCs. Other than that, there won't be any trouble. :3
61 comments
if I want to give restoration poison perks to necromancers for example… is it currently setup for such? Thx
In this example the necromancer may get the perk if they have a high enough restoration skill, but possibly also healing perks for the living, which they likely won't make use of anyways.
thx.
For the Adamant version I manually assigned perks. Such as Necromancers with poison spells would also always have access to some poison perks in the Restoration Tree.
curious if I can achieve a similar result with SPID for Vokriinator.
Guide here. The Syntax looks as follows in general:
FormType = FormOrEditorID|StringFilters|FormFilters|LevelFilters|TraitFilters|CountOrPackageIndex|Chance
Faction:
Perk = 0xXXXXX~Placeholder.esm|NONE|YOUR FACTION HERE|PERK TREE(SKILL REQUIRED)|NONE|NONE|CHANCE
Wildcard:
Perk = 0xXXXXX~Placeholder.esm|*NAME (like *Necromancer)|NONE|PERK TREE(SKILL REQUIRED)|NONE|NONE|CHANCE
Name:
Perk = 0xXXXXX~Placeholder.esm|EXACT NAME (or) EDITOR ID (like Novice Necromancer,Adapt Necromancer|NONE|PERK TREE(SKILL REQUIRED)|NONE|NONE|CHANCE
Final result via Faction (Without access to xEdit right now..):
;Example Perk
Perk = 0x12345~Adamant.esp|NONE|0x54321|16(30)|NONE|NONE|25
This would give the example perk to everyone in the faction specified - but not actually existing... - to those with a Restoration level of at least 30 with a chance of 25 %
You will have to replace XXXXX with the ID of the perk and replace Placeholder with the esp/esm you want to target. Perk numbers can be seen in the guide (0-17) And chances can now be between 0.1 and 100. IDs, names, etc. Can be looked up via xEdit.
It can be quite "some" work, but this would eliminate potential conflicts, that would arise with a standard esp. Of course you can do so much more via SPID, those are just some basic examples on what to expect how your SPID file may look like.
Should still work fine with your mod, any perks removed were not assigned to NPCs, but there are a few Adamant Perks I may wish to distribute.
Vokord - Perk Overhaul
thanks
Admittingly, I'm not sure if Adamant / Mystisism compatibility will be a thing though..
1. I have everything set up for Odin and am a manual modder - yup those still exist~ and am already months behind schedule... (The Mystisism requirement and potential compatibility issues are the reasons I chose the base version of Vokriinator btw)
2. I REALLY can't bring myself to boot into windows anymore despite loving to mod - more of a lack of proper accessibility features compared to Linux really.
3. I'm actually also thinking about pulling back from the modding scene. (unwillingly mind you)
So, while I will gladly adjust my mod to work better for Vokord, a proper version may not happen on my part. Of course it is only really a thing of what the ID is named for me to set things up properly, so you could just name the IDs for the Adamant / Mystisims stuff and I could include them (with credits). Alternatively it may be better if I update the existing things and then you take over that version if you want to?
I should clarify that Vokord doesn’t require Adamant. I duplicated a few of the perks, and NPCs can’t use em all. Plus those in Enai’s Vokrii mysticism patch. Combined, these are currently the additional perks. IMG
For the most part Enemy Onslaught is just SRCEO with additional spells given to casters to flesh out their distinction a bit more where they would benefit more from certain perk trees. Would it be easier if I created and assigned a few custom classes with modified skill weight?
was curious on your thoughts/preference to Odin vs Mysticism?
And yes, I've read about Adamant not being a requirement and actually integrated partially. Personally I think that's a great idea to increase the diversity further with (hopefully) less of a compatibility nightmare!
As for custom classes; yes, they MAY benefit from a custom class, but to me the difference is really just minimal since the amount of attributes and skill levels are restricted per level, no matter what you enter - attributes are 6 and skills I believe also. The work to assign those classes can become quite tiresome for potentially small differences. I would only recommend doing custom classes for custom characters, as it's easier to make them rather than find a fitting one, whereas I believe (or hope) that the existing characters and their classes are well enough fleshed out to properly benefit from SPID mods. So, no, I wouldn't go that extra mile for a potentially tiny change.
Odin vs. Mysticism: I actually used Mysticism for much longer than Odin and liked it. It's just so damn cluttered with spells doing the same with just more powerful versions, whereas Odin is a bit simpler. Especially notable with lock and resistance spells. Mysticism has 5 open lock spells (for each level) and many resistance spells for each element individually. Odin has 2 weaken lock spells and 2 resistance spells for all the elements, which is far easier to handle. Mysticism turns master level spells into one-handed casts, Odin allows mind influencing spells to have a chance to work on higher level targets. Both have their allure in that case, but as anti-mage wanting more diversity for NPCs and loving illusion, it's a no-brainer to not see that a Embershard bandit is fully immune to fury anymore! Otherwise they don't differ that much IMO. Apocalypse folks will also benefit with Odin as duplicate spells will be skipped, so even less unnecessary clutter to deal with! Those 2 mods really need to be tested to determine which one works better though, both are great in their own ways!
And while I'm currently merely tracking your mod, I would most likely switch to it if there was a version suited for Odin users without the need for Mysticism (didn't bring it up till now, because I wanted to give you time to set everything up first ^^; )
Disorienting Blow is a block perk connecting from Stunning Strike Perk and requires 60 blocking "Bashing causes enemies to take 25% more damage for 10 seconds. ". Sorry it's actual name is disorienting bash in game. It's in the vokriinator.esp.
Underworld contracts would be moot since it just increases sale prices to fences.
One thing to note is the Vokrii - Mysticism patch should have precedent over the Mysticism ordinator patch. Alternation we'd want to be using the vokrii mysticism patch perks for example.
I am a bit confused by references to MysticOrdinator.esp under Conjuration, Illusion and Restoration. The MysticOrdinator.esp does not contain perk records on my end, just magic effects?
Underworld Contacts has been removed, Disorienting Bash has been updated, all instances of ordinator targeting is now directed to the Vokrii patch instead. I'm also a bit torn about the Restoration perks Withering & Corrosion as it seems they had a different Plugin ID than the others. Sorry, I'm pretty much doing this blindly without modding tools as I'm a bit too lazy/blind to do things in windows anymore as well as do all the changes to my manual setup for a simple test file, so errors can happen, that's why I preferred doing this test file before a public release.. ^^;
And yes, you could add the perks from that file to the real upload and do some changes to make them more gameplay friendly if you want to. But once everything is properly set and targeted, I will do a proper and public release of the Vokord version, unless you would prefer taking over of course?
With regards to withering and corrosion. I believe it's because they are exclusive forms/perks in the vokrii mysticism patch. The other ones all replace / edit existing vokrii perks.
Added a note in my file so I won't forget or anything, although I will go through the entire perk list once everything is set up and running of course.
And thank you for pointing this out! I already read on your description that there were some changes about unarmed perks, but admittedly forgot about asking it in the end.. :P
Edit: Leaving the distribution as is won't break anything btw, it's just not consistent with the requirements of the player.
Some perks I have reduced the number of multitple points you can spend while increasing the progression jump, as I wanted to reduce the number of 3 level perks.
Doesn’t really change much for NPCs since as in most cases the putting 2 points into a perk would equal putting 3 points where I slimmed the progression. level 3 still exists but is just not accessible to the player.
Was debating making mastery points just 1 level but more conflicted about that.
Essentially it means that first mastery perk in any skill tree is going to be very impactful out of the gate, but that may have balance implications early game. what are your thoughts?
And would this create more work for you?
Anyways; I know there is a mod to raise mastery perk levels to 5, which should be working with Vokord out of the box, but that's clearly too much to invest IMO. Whether to leave mastery perks at 2 or lower it to just 1 I'm not quite sure, as 1 sounds a bit too strong whereas 2 would take more perk points away you would want to invest in other stuff. On the other hand reducing the 3 tier perks to just 2 while keeping their strength at a similar level sounds like a really good decision to make the mod less intimidating IMO.
As for work on my part; I assume if you ditch the 3rd tier, I would probably just do the same and change the level requirements of the first 2 tiers (If at all) for everything to stay in sync. With the mastery perks it would need to be those coming from Ordinator for me to only do minor changes, as my mod scans for the xxx00 and xxx20 IDs, but changing that into the Vokrii IDs instead won't be such an issue either.
I'm just not sure if there will be an update this year since there is currently too much happening IRL and I don't have the head for modding among other things. And also sorry in advance if I'm not responding for a while again..
No big rush. I am working on a Dragonborn Bestiary project and a SPID for spell distribution version of Revamped Releveled + Enemy Onslaught. I assume I'd use a similar method for spell distribution as is used for perk distribution?
Personally I would probably scan for both; classes and combat styles SEPERATELY, as mod support is always a concern IMO and you should make sure the right NPCs get the correct spells (I got a SPID mod that gives Whiterun citizens the reanimation spells, funny with the Bandit Raid mod, but most people would dislike this)
To further combat this, you may also want to try the wildcard approach as well. Like *Pyro or *Pyromancer for fire spells, though this can be a bit restrictive as well.
So you may have to test out things with either Classes or Combat styles, with and without wildcards. But in the end it is easily more compatible with other mods than doing it the classic way via ESP edits IMHO.
I just got back to my PC
But no, I don't need anything right now. Took a break from modding to set everything fully up on Linux first and randomly found out how modding would work on Linux, yay! Sadly xedit, Synthesis and
Nemesisstill bugging out,. so my priority lies in fixing those first before getting back to work at creating the Vokord plugin, but I'll get there eventually! :3Also struggling heavily with motivation and frustration recently, that I can't even bring myself to touch anything Skyrim anymore aside from yet another pointless attempt at getting Synthesis to finally run without frying my machine.. Ugh, last thing forbidding me to finally ditch windows for good...
Can't say when or if I will return to modding though, slowly finding modding more draining than fulfilling as well. But maybe I will find a burst of motivation at some point again and get back to work though.
I may try the implementation of NPCs learn spells and skills
Is there something obvious you look for when you know the perk should not be distributed to NPCs? I was assigning perks in conjuration for example to necromancer and Conjurer but noticed quite a few Ordinator perks are not available in the SPID that seem like they could be ok on NPCs?
As for determining which perks to distibute; It can be a bit of a b**** at times, where you may have to guess or have blaring sirens, telling you how much use the perks may have on NPCs. I first had this issue in a bug report for the 1H perk Judgment, which would target the player rather than also potentially allowing NPCs. The perk clearly used the player as a reference in this case and the result showed quite well in-game.
So just check for player references in perks? Not quite. Sometimes conditions are also hidden inside spells and magic effects as well as scripts. Meaning you would have to check up on each perk / spell / magic effect and possibly their scripts (within xedit is enough) and then determine whether they are safe to use by NPCs or may not work whatsoever.
Aside from checking those out, you may also have to take a look at multiple instances for a perk, where there is a second one with the word "proc" in it's name, those are pretty much guaranteed to cause issues if you ask me.
Fortunately you would only have to check up on everything that has changed between my base Vokriinator and your Vokord, so it's not too much bug hunting or more like player reference hunting really. Again, some are pretty obvious, others may be more hidden and harder to understand if NPCs can do anything with those perks at all. But checking up on all perks / spells / magic effects directed to the perks and referencing the player or not should be enough to figure this one out.
I do see it's condition is subject is player, could this just be changed to subject is caster instead for NPCs to use it? Or would it then just reduce the resistances of him and his allies?
I also notice quite a few of the elemental destruction perks are not distributed to NPCs
Guess the best you could do is to try it out and see for yourself? As for Plague Doctor; I took a look and aside from various intimidation quests, it seems to be just fine to use for NPCs, I guess it's safe but then again, Distorted Shape sounded fine as well. So even if you try your best to make an as best as possible working NPC addon, it may still break for seemingly no reason.
On the other hand you don't have to worry so much about compatibility with other mods like I would if I would dare change any perks to potentially make them compatible with NPCs as you already got a plugin and patches for your mod. And quite frankly I can't tell you anymore why I decided against the Plague Doctor perk after looking it up.. ^^;
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/37228?tab=description&BH=2
That being said; It is actually FULLY compatible then as my mod requires Vokrii and Ordinator, which EEOS doesn't (anymore??). So you can run them both together without giving out too many perks to NPCs. Sorry about the misinformation, I was absolutely certain it would support Ordinator.. (and possibly Vokrii)
Of course, having both mods installed can still greatly increase difficulty, so balancing can still be an issue and may need some fine-tuning.
Balance is not too much of a concern for me as I am going through the game with a whole party of followers, so I need as much challenge as I can get. On that note, Vokriinator for NPCs works on followers, too, right?
And yes, followers are included. If you:
1: Want every character to have the same chance of perk distribution, take the regular version.
2. Don't want followers to gain them, take the no follower version.
3. You could also just have followers gain perks via follower only option.
4. If you want powerful followers and say a 25% chance for other NPCs, you can mix the no follower option and the follower only option as well!
But if challenge is what you seek, then you're probably better off using either the normal or the no follower option.
It's mostly untested, just giving out stuff that seemed like NPCs could use.
does it splode?
In short, the existing file is already good for Vokriinator Black.