Considering Johnson Ting works in the industry, has been featured on misc websites (http://kotaku.com/japan-in-2022-looks-exactly-like-youd-expect-1668030166), is a professional artist, and considering the intellectual property rights dictated on Deviantart, he does have the right to request to take it down. You can offer explanations and excuses considering the differences and discrepencies, but the point remains that this was based off of someones copyrighted personal concept. It's not a licensed character available to be used by the public unless explicit permissions are designated by the author.
Using a concept done by a company that licenses the work and then significantly altering the concept to reflect your own personal taste, as done many times by Zeroking, is not the same as taking someones personal work without permission. The author has stated that he would like this armor taken down, or at the very least not released.
Again, borrowing a concept from a company whose own profit relies on people buying the licensed product they put out, and then taking said concept and altering it to the point that it becomes another thing entirely is another ball game. Newermind43 has stolen a concept from a person, and barely altered it at all, let alone give credit or ask for permissions. You all keep quoting licensed work that is owned by studios; a person's work falls under intellectual property and is bound ethically by this, save for the permissions the author themselves give to whoever wishes to borrow.
The difference between Zeroking and Newermind is Zeroking steals concepts, but he makes it his own thing, and if he isn't sure about using a work he asks permission, as done with his Mavari Armor. Some semblance remains, but overall you could call the work he produces his own; Newermind's works could be argued as ripoffs of Zeroking's own work. But this derails the argument with personal bias and does nothing constructive save make a case for Newermind being really really bad at ethics, or at least artistic license.
What remains is that the author would like to see these images taken down, or at the very least a restriction on its release. I am sure he would compromise if it was altered, but what it boils down to is terrible ethics on Newermind's part.
tl;dr:
Works copyrighted by a company that are borrowed from and signifigantly altered to reflect the tastes of the artist =/= works that fall under intellectual property that are stolen from without permissions or comment from the original author.
This could've just been resolved in hindsight if Newermind just asked.
The dates of the original work and the release of the screenshots would be extremely hard to argue as coincidence.
You posted your first image for this armor mod Dec. 27th. Not long before that on Dec. 18th the author in the above link posted their work, which amazingly looks almost exactly like this armor. I've notified the original author of this in advance.
Before accusing someone of theft you should actually look at both images.
Horus is not exactly original or copyrighted and as for the wings on a helmet, they are not copyrights, the basic helmet may have a few similarities not its not the same.
..but you could equally say this and the deviant art authors helmet have similarities to the Timeshift game helmet and the Horus guards helmets from Stargate and SG-1
You do realise there is a huge difference between the two?
For one this doesn't even resemble the link you posted and for two if he was modelling based on that he hasn't broken any rule whatsoever, what the author has done in your link is a drawing a far cry from 3d modelling.
While you're at it why don't you notify Blizzard for all the armors that are apparently "stolen" from here because they've all done the same thing.
Next time before you accuse someone work out the differences between public concept art that has been posted on the public web and actually stealing. Similarities between the winged helm does not constitute stealing.
I have to desagree with you Deceptive warrior. If this armor is released, it should be done with permission or at least some credit for the concept artist. I'm a concept artist myself on deviant-art, this community is not greedy at all but deserves some consideration. The armor share clearly the same concept as the painting.
Then the author either has not seen the image of this armor or is a complete and utter fool because Horus is not exactly copyrighted and wings on a helmet, is not his copyright.
That is fair enough and i can respect that, my point was there are a lot of people quick to jump on other modders for "stealing" the difference between 3d modelling and concept art is huge and neither can easily replace the other (You do have the talented artists who can do both).
This might've played very differently if he had just asked politely about utilising concept art, but lets be fair all concept art and armor models are in some ways inspired by something else.
We all draw inspiration from somewhere and if utilising concept art was to be deemed illegal then plenty of big corporations would have a field day.
That isn't to mention that this armor hasn't even been released yet.
I'm sure jojjo didn't write to Blizzard to ask permission to utilise Frostmourne's likeness in his mods.
In response to the authors response.
Unless this armor is a carbon copy of his concept art, i doubt it's even against the rules, yes its rude of newermind to not mention where he drew his inspiration from but it wasn't like he went and stole someone else's 3d model and then claimed it to be his own.
This armor is an intepretation of said concept art, given that 3d modelling is no easy feat and the work he's done here is purely his own work. To me the armor deviates enough from the concept art that it's no where near considered stealing. Even if it was a carbon copy of the concept art you'd be hardpressed to find any support for it, it would be like saying jojjo's Frostmourne Sword and Armor is stealing because he based his models entirely from Arthas in Warcraft 3.
The other thing is, modelling off art that is publicly avaliable is not against the rules. If it was then almost every single armor mod that is derivative of any game would be because its using their likeness and the original author's concept art.
I sincerely doubt that despite Zerofrust mentioning that he is a Dark Souls fan and that this armor is based on Ornstein that he went and asked FromSoft for permission to model his armor based on their concept art. This is exactly the same thing as what you're accusing newermind of. If he is forced to take this down then so should basically every single mod that is based on something else.
Considering Johnson Ting works in the industry, has been featured on misc websites (http://kotaku.com/japan-in-2022-looks-exactly-like-youd-expect-1668030166), is a professional artist, and considering the intellectual property rights dictated on Deviantart, he does have the right to request to take it down. You can offer explanations and excuses considering the differences and discrepencies, but the point remains that this was based off of someones copyrighted personal concept. It's not a licensed character available to be used by the public unless explicit permissions are designated by the author.
Using a concept done by a company that licenses the work and then significantly altering the concept to reflect your own personal taste, as done many times by Zeroking, is not the same as taking someones personal work without permission. The author has stated that he would like this armor taken down, or at the very least not released.
Again, borrowing a concept from a company whose own profit relies on people buying the licensed product they put out, and then taking said concept and altering it to the point that it becomes another thing entirely is another ball game. Newermind43 has stolen a concept from a person, and barely altered it at all, let alone give credit or ask for permissions. You all keep quoting licensed work that is owned by studios; a person's work falls under intellectual property and is bound ethically by this, save for the permissions the author themselves give to whoever wishes to borrow.
The difference between Zeroking and Newermind is Zeroking steals concepts, but he makes it his own thing, and if he isn't sure about using a work he asks permission, as done with his Mavari Armor. Some semblance remains, but overall you could call the work he produces his own; Newermind's works could be argued as ripoffs of Zeroking's own work. But this derails the argument with personal bias and does nothing constructive save make a case for Newermind being really really bad at ethics, or at least artistic license.
What remains is that the author would like to see these images taken down, or at the very least a restriction on its release. I am sure he would compromise if it was altered, but what it boils down to is terrible ethics on Newermind's part.
tl;dr:
Works copyrighted by a company that are borrowed from and signifigantly altered to reflect the tastes of the artist =/= works that fall under intellectual property that are stolen from without permissions or comment from the original author.
This could've just been resolved in hindsight if Newermind just asked.
The dates of the original work and the release of the screenshots would be extremely hard to argue as coincidence.
Your entire theory rests on the difference between the end product of a respective author and the concept it was based on? To me that concept does not differ in the slightests from the movie portrayals of Thor's armor and neither does this concept differ a great deal with the Berserker Armor that the armor was based on.
It is absurd that you would even suggest this notion because i am just as certain that this mod directly replicates the weapons utilised by weta workshop for the LOTR/Hobbit movies.
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/5727/?
Yes it is all licensed work and said work was concieved by individuals when the movies/games/comics/manga was concieved and i am absolutely certain that these same individuals did not explicitly given permission for freelance modders to replicate their work.
Legally you have absolutely no ground to stand on and as a moderator has previously stated, this work won't be taken down based on the evidence you have provided. There is enough deviance from both the armor and the helmet that to me that if you were to show both pictures seperately i would've doubted that newermind's armor was even based on the Wings of Horus.
They bear similarities but thats about it. Based on your logic, a helluva lot of mods on this site wouldn't be allowed.
Hell based on what you're saying why don't you go notify the same author for replicating the Halo Designs
You never use google images for "FEMALE ARMOR" ? Everyone gets ideas from images...
beside theyre completely different.just the belt and the helmet are alike
also he didnt use the mash made by the other guy...just a replica...and as long as it is free it is okay...here are many mods such as demonhunter armors that aim to resemple armors from other games
Looks amazeballs! If you'd like some feedback I'd say that the clavicle/shoulder area is a tad lacking, maybe add some ornaments to the shoulder, add a scarf-thing or a collar. Anyways, looking smashing!
Personally, I like the shoulder area as it is. And that's mainly because I use mods like Cloaks of Skyrim and Winter is coming, Fur collar etc... So for me there is no need for scarf or something else. :-)
The armour looks very very good. It looks usable - I mean, that it looks like it really could and would protect its character from injury (and the surrounding harsh environment).
Give Feedback
20 comments
Armors are different. Think before posting.
http://www.deviantart.com/art/Wings-of-Horus-500970254
You posted your first image for this armor mod Dec. 27th. Not long before that on Dec. 18th the author in the above link posted their work, which amazingly looks almost exactly like this armor. I've notified the original author of this in advance.
For one this doesn't even resemble the link you posted and for two if he was modelling based on that he hasn't broken any rule whatsoever, what the author has done in your link is a drawing a far cry from 3d modelling.
While you're at it why don't you notify Blizzard for all the armors that are apparently "stolen" from here because they've all done the same thing.
Next time before you accuse someone work out the differences between public concept art that has been posted on the public web and actually stealing. Similarities between the winged helm does not constitute stealing.
The armor share clearly the same concept as the painting.
I think the author of the original work thinks differently.
http://i.imgur.com/DKAWP1M.jpg\
This might've played very differently if he had just asked politely about utilising concept art, but lets be fair all concept art and armor models are in some ways inspired by something else.
We all draw inspiration from somewhere and if utilising concept art was to be deemed illegal then plenty of big corporations would have a field day.
That isn't to mention that this armor hasn't even been released yet.
I'm sure jojjo didn't write to Blizzard to ask permission to utilise Frostmourne's likeness in his mods.
In response to the authors response.
Unless this armor is a carbon copy of his concept art, i doubt it's even against the rules, yes its rude of newermind to not mention where he drew his inspiration from but it wasn't like he went and stole someone else's 3d model and then claimed it to be his own.
This armor is an intepretation of said concept art, given that 3d modelling is no easy feat and the work he's done here is purely his own work. To me the armor deviates enough from the concept art that it's no where near considered stealing. Even if it was a carbon copy of the concept art you'd be hardpressed to find any support for it, it would be like saying jojjo's Frostmourne Sword and Armor is stealing because he based his models entirely from Arthas in Warcraft 3.
The other thing is, modelling off art that is publicly avaliable is not against the rules. If it was then almost every single armor mod that is derivative of any game would be because its using their likeness and the original author's concept art.
This is zerofrust's Knights of the Thorn Armor
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/18940/?
This is concept art from FromSoft's Ornstein
http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131219120729/darksouls/images/0/08/Ornstein_Concept_Art.jpg
Would you call that stealing?
I sincerely doubt that despite Zerofrust mentioning that he is a Dark Souls fan and that this armor is based on Ornstein that he went and asked FromSoft for permission to model his armor based on their concept art. This is exactly the same thing as what you're accusing newermind of. If he is forced to take this down then so should basically every single mod that is based on something else.
Using a concept done by a company that licenses the work and then significantly altering the concept to reflect your own personal taste, as done many times by Zeroking, is not the same as taking someones personal work without permission. The author has stated that he would like this armor taken down, or at the very least not released.
Again, borrowing a concept from a company whose own profit relies on people buying the licensed product they put out, and then taking said concept and altering it to the point that it becomes another thing entirely is another ball game. Newermind43 has stolen a concept from a person, and barely altered it at all, let alone give credit or ask for permissions. You all keep quoting licensed work that is owned by studios; a person's work falls under intellectual property and is bound ethically by this, save for the permissions the author themselves give to whoever wishes to borrow.
The difference between Zeroking and Newermind is Zeroking steals concepts, but he makes it his own thing, and if he isn't sure about using a work he asks permission, as done with his Mavari Armor. Some semblance remains, but overall you could call the work he produces his own; Newermind's works could be argued as ripoffs of Zeroking's own work. But this derails the argument with personal bias and does nothing constructive save make a case for Newermind being really really bad at ethics, or at least artistic license.
What remains is that the author would like to see these images taken down, or at the very least a restriction on its release. I am sure he would compromise if it was altered, but what it boils down to is terrible ethics on Newermind's part.
tl;dr:
Works copyrighted by a company that are borrowed from and signifigantly altered to reflect the tastes of the artist =/= works that fall under intellectual property that are stolen from without permissions or comment from the original author.
This could've just been resolved in hindsight if Newermind just asked.
The dates of the original work and the release of the screenshots would be extremely hard to argue as coincidence.
http://zerofrust.deviantart.com/art/Asgardian-Armor-For-Skyrim-2-300331378
Your entire theory rests on the difference between the end product of a respective author and the concept it was based on? To me that concept does not differ in the slightests from the movie portrayals of Thor's armor and neither does this concept differ a great deal with the Berserker Armor that the armor was based on.
http://zerofrust.deviantart.com/art/Guts-Berserker-Armor-For-Skyrim-295787655?q=gallery%3AZerofrust%2F24716317&qo=70
It is absurd that you would even suggest this notion because i am just as certain that this mod directly replicates the weapons utilised by weta workshop for the LOTR/Hobbit movies.
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/5727/?
Yes it is all licensed work and said work was concieved by individuals when the movies/games/comics/manga was concieved and i am absolutely certain that these same individuals did not explicitly given permission for freelance modders to replicate their work.
Legally you have absolutely no ground to stand on and as a moderator has previously stated, this work won't be taken down based on the evidence you have provided. There is enough deviance from both the armor and the helmet that to me that if you were to show both pictures seperately i would've doubted that newermind's armor was even based on the Wings of Horus.
They bear similarities but thats about it. Based on your logic, a helluva lot of mods on this site wouldn't be allowed.
Hell based on what you're saying why don't you go notify the same author for replicating the Halo Designs
http://johnsonting.deviantart.com/art/The-chief-and-the-spartan-428232951
Everyone gets ideas from images...
beside theyre completely different.just the belt and the helmet are alike
also he didnt use the mash made by the other guy...just a replica...and as long as it is free it is okay...here are many mods such as demonhunter armors that aim to resemple armors from other games
If you'd like some feedback I'd say that the clavicle/shoulder area is a tad lacking, maybe add some ornaments to the shoulder, add a scarf-thing or a collar. Anyways, looking smashing!
The armour looks very very good.
It looks usable - I mean, that it looks like it really could and would protect its character from injury (and the surrounding harsh environment).
Great job, Newermind43. As always.